Best of the Spectator

My guest on this week’s podcast is the historian Anne Sebba. In her new book The Women’s Orchestra of Auschwitz: A Story of Survival, Anne tells the story of how a ragtag group of women musicians formed in the shadow of Auschwitz’s crematoria. She tells me about the moral trade-offs, the friendships and enmities that formed, and what it meant to try to create music in a situation of unrelenting horror.

Transcribed - Published: 30 April 2025

Mark Carney has won the Canadian election, leading the Liberal Party to a fourth term. Having only been Prime Minister for 6 weeks, succeeding Justin Trudeau, this is an impressive achievement when you consider that Pierre Poilievre’s Conservatives were over 20 percentage points ahead in the polls earlier this year. Trump’s rhetoric against Canada – engaging in a trade war and calling for the country to become the 51st state – is credited as turning around the fortunes of the Liberals. Are there lessons for conservatives across the anglosphere, including Kemi Badenoch? Patrick Gibbons speaks to James Heale and Michael Martins. Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 29 April 2025

Kirsty Wark has worked for the BBC for almost 50 years and is one of the UK’s most recognisable broadcasters. In 1976 she joined BBC Radio Scotland as a graduate researcher. Having produced and presented several shows across radio including The World At One and PM, she switched to television, and went on to present shows such as Breakfast Timeand The Late Show. However, she is best known for presenting BBC Newsnight for over 30 years, which saw her interview key political and cultural leaders. Having stood down after the 2024 election, she now presents Front Row, The Reunion, and documentaries like Icons of Style. On the podcast, Kirsty tells Katy about her father fighting in the D-Day landings, changing attitudes over time towards women at the BBC and her views on British & Scottish identities. They also unpack BBC impartiality, how it should be a ‘trusted friend’ to the public and why she left Newsnight. As one of the best-known political interviewers in the UK, Kirsty also explains how she gamed interviews, and the memorable ones from Michael Portillo to Jeffrey Archer to the one that made her name – Margaret Thatcher. Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 28 April 2025

Earlier this year Dr Kurt Martens, Professor of Canon Law at the Catholic University of America, joined Damian Thompson on Holy Smoke to unpack what happens during a papal conclave. There was heightened interest in the process due to the film Conclave, which swept the awards season, but also because Pope Francis was hospitalised at the time. Despite showing some signs of recovery – including being able to meet world leaders such as King Charles III and J.D. Vance – Pope Francis died on Easter Monday. Here we reissue the episode with Dr Martens, looking at what happens when a pope dies, with a new introduction from Damian. Writing the cover article for the Spectator this week, Damian writes: ‘the next Vicar of Christ will face challenges that dwarf those that confronted any incoming pope in living memory. The Church is mired in doctrinal confusion; its structures of government are fragmented; sexual scandals have been hushed up at the highest level; and it is staring into a financial abyss’. What can we expect from the upcoming conclave?  Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 27 April 2025

Legendary pollster Prof Sir John Curtice joins the Spectator’s deputy political editor James Heale to look ahead to next week’s local elections. The actual number of seats may be small, as John points out, but the political significance could be much greater. If polling is correct, Reform could win a ‘fresh’ by-election for the first time, the mayoralties could be shared between three or more parties, and we could see a fairly even split in terms of vote share across five parties (Labour, the Liberal Democrats, the Conservatives, the Green party, and Reform UK).  The 2024 general election saw five GB-wide parties contest most seats for the first time. These set of local elections could solidify this ‘five-party political system'. In fact, says John, ‘Reform have already won these local elections’ by virtue of being able to contest all the seats available. Are we headed for a different kind of politics in Britain? Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 26 April 2025

On this week’s Spectator Out Loud: Owen Matthews reads his letter from Rome (1:21); Matthew Parris travels the Channel Islands (7:53); Reviewing Minoo Dinshaw, Marcus Nevitt looks at Bulstrode Whitelocke and Edward Hyde, once close colleagues who fell out during the English civil war (15:19); Angus Colwell discusses his Marco Pierre White obsession, aided by the chef himself (21:26); and, Sean Thomas provides his notes on boredom (26:28).  Produced and presented by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 25 April 2025

This week: the many crises awaiting the next pope ‘Francis was a charismatic pope loved by most of the world’s 1.4 billion Catholics’ writes Damian Thompson in the cover article this week. But few of them ‘grasp the scale of the crisis in the Church… The next Vicar of Christ, liberal or conservative’ faces ‘challenges that dwarf those that confronted any incoming pope in living memory’.  Ahead of Pope Francis’s funeral this weekend, Damian joined the podcast alongside the Catholic theologian Fr Alexander Lucie-Smith to unpack all the political intrigue underpinning the upcoming papal conclave. They say that he who enters the conclave as a pope, leaves as a cardinal – do we have any clues to who could emerge as Francis’s successor? (1:01) Next: the ghastliness of AI ghouls The late Lily Parr – a chain-smoking, 6ft, Lancastrian, lesbian pre-war footballer – has been resurrected via an AI avatar. All fun and games at first glance but, as Mary Wakefield writes in the magazine this week, what the AI’s creators have summoned is ‘a ghoul, a flimsy echo of Parr, infused with the spirit of Gen Z’, lacking the original’s character. Aside from the obvious issues, is this ethical, or even legal? Mary worries that overworked and underpaid teachers could soon deploy AI to summon the spirit of Churchill or Shakespeare. How concerned should we be about AI creep? Mary joined the podcast to discuss. We thought who better to ask about AI than AI itself so ChatGPT’s latest AI model joined Mary to answer a few questions… (19:09) And finally: long live long lunch! Kenton Allen writes in defence of the traditional business lunch in the magazine this week. And it should be two hours at a minimum. This isn’t a ‘long’ lunch, he says, but a ‘proper’ lunch. What does the decline of the work lunch tell us about society today? Kenton joined the podcast alongside the Spectator’s restaurant critic Tanya Gold. They say there was a serious purpose to a long lunch, something being lost today by the modern workforce. Plus, they share their restaurant tips for the best long lunch. (27:46) Presented by William Moore and Lara Prendergast. Produced by Patrick Gibbons and Oscar Edmondson.

Transcribed - Published: 24 April 2025

My guest on this week’s Book Club podcast is Lamorna Ash, author of Don’t Forget We’re Here Forever: A New Generation’s Search for Religion. She describes to me how a magazine piece about some young friends who made a dramatic conversion to Christianity turned into an investigation into the rise in faith among a generation that many assumed would be the most secular yet — and into a personal journey towards religious belief.

Transcribed - Published: 23 April 2025

Roger Pizey is a baker, chef and one of the most influential pâtissiers in the UK. He started his culinary journey as an apprentice at La Gavroche under Albert Roux before taking on the role of head of pastry at Marco Pierre White’s Harveys, during the time it achieved three Michelin stars. He has since worked at a number of London institutions and now serves as the head of pastry at Fortnum and Mason. On the podcast he tells Liv and Lara about childhood memories of Manchester tart, what he learnt from Albert Roux and Marco Pierre White, and why Fortnum’s rose éclair is the perfect dessert. Photo credit: Michael Barrow

Transcribed - Published: 22 April 2025

Deborah Mattinson joined the House of Lords as a Labour peer in February. Her involvement in politics began when she worked alongside Peter Mandelson and Philip Gould to create Labour’s Shadow Communications Agency for Neil Kinnock. In 1992 she co-founded Opinion Leader Research, and she went on to advise Tony Blair ahead of the 1997 election and later became Gordon Brown’s chief pollster. In 2021 she was appointed Director of Strategy for Keir Starmer, a position she held until stepping down following last year’s landslide victory. On the podcast, Deborah tells Katy Balls about growing up as a Labour supporter with a father active in local Tory politics, the work hard/play hard culture of advertising in the 1980s and how to decipher what voters really think during focus groups. They also talk about the differences between the 1987, ‘92, and ‘97 campaigns, the ‘Hero voters’ that were key to Labour’s electoral success in 2024 and how Labour can best tackle the threat from Reform today. With experience working with Labour spanning four decades, they touch on the Labour giants she worked with, including Alf (now Lord) Dubs, Peter (now Ambassador – also Lord) Mandelson and, more recently, the Prime Minister Keir Starmer. Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 22 April 2025

Pope Francis, the head of the Roman Catholic Church, has died. The Argentinian, the first Latin American – and the first Jesuit – to lead the Church, has been the head of the Holy See for 12 years, succeeding Pope Benedict XVI who resigned in 2013. Francis presided over the funeral of his predecessor, who died in 2022 – a first in modern history. But Francis’s leadership has been historic for many other reasons. In fact, says Damian Thompson, his reign has been ‘one of the most memorable, if controversial – not just in recent years but in recent centuries’. Liberals lauded his position on a number of social issues, while Conservatives saw the papacy as over-reaching and out of touch with every-day Catholics. But is it really that simple? Catholic priest and theologian Father Alexander Lucie-Smith joins Damian to react to the news of the Pope’s death. Fr Alexander says that while Francis ‘defies summary’, it is incredible to consider how far the papacy has changed when comparing him to his predecessors, even those of the 20th Century like Pope Pius XII. What will his legacy be? Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 21 April 2025

The Liberal Democrats’ foreign affairs spokesperson Calum Miller, elected as the new MP for Bicester and Woodstock last year, joins James Heale to talk about the ambitions of the party that became the largest third party in Parliament in 100 years at the 2024 general election. They want to overtake the Conservatives to be the second party in local government – could they one day overtake the Tories to become the official opposition?  A former civil servant, Oxford University policy manager and councillor, Calum joins Coffee House Shots to talk about why he got into politics, how Brexit radicalised his desire for good governance and why, for all the fun, there is a serious point behind Ed Davey’s stunts.  Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 21 April 2025

The Easter issue of the Spectator includes two provocative articles exploring aspects of Christianity. Nigel Biggar, Regius professor emeritus of moral theology at Oxford University, now a Conservative peer, celebrates the heroic ‘faithful dissent’ of Christian heroes such as Thomas More and Helmuth von Moltke, who lost their lives rather than defend injustice. Meanwhile Spectator columnist Mary Wakefield interviews Roman Williams, former Archbishop of Canterbury. She’s inspired by his holiness but depressed by his use of ‘C of E bureaucratese’ to uphold liberal orthodoxy on subjects such as gender ideology. But, she says they can share an uncomfortable space together within faith. In this episode of Holy Smoke, Nigel and Mary join Damian Thompson, who asks them: how can Christians embrace ‘faithful dissent’ in an era of conformist Christian leaders who parrot the platitudes of secular opinion? Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 20 April 2025

Katy Balls joins Coffee House Shots for the last time as the Spectator’s political editor. Having joined the magazine ten years ago – or six prime ministers in Downing St years – what are her reflections on British politics? Katy’s lobby lunch partner from the Financial Times Stephen Bush joins Katy and Patrick Gibbons to try and make sense of a turbulent political decade, work out where the greatest risk is to the current Labour government, and attempt to make some predictions for the next ten years.  Produced by Patrick Gibbons. 

Transcribed - Published: 19 April 2025

On this week’s Spectator Out Loud: Would Trump really bomb Iran, asks Paul Wood (1:38); Katy Balls interviews Health Secretary Wes Streeting on NHS reform, Blairism and Game of Thrones (8:38); Olivia Potts examines the history – and decline – of the Easter staple, roast lamb (18:25); the explorer Benedict Allen says Erling Kagge and Neil Shubin were both dicing with death, as he reviews both their books on exploration to earth’s poles (22:13); Cosmo Landesman reflects on what turning 70 has meant for his sex life (28:46); and, Aidan Hartley takes us on an anthropomorphic journey across Africa (33:55).  Produced and presented by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 18 April 2025

This week: should the assisted dying bill be killed off? Six months after Kim Leadbeater MP launched the Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill, a group of Labour MPs have pronounced it ‘irredeemably flawed and not fit to become law’. They say the most basic aspects of the bill – having gone through its committee stage – do not hold up to scrutiny. Dan Hitchens agrees, writing in the magazine this week that ‘it’s hard to summarise the committee’s proceedings except with a kind of Homeric catalogue of rejected amendments’ accompanied by a ‘series of disconcerting public statements’. With a third reading vote approaching, what could it tell us about the country we live in? Dan joins the podcast alongside the Revd Fergus Butler-Gallie, who provides the Spectator’s diary for the week. (1:34) Next: where are all the rabbits? If you’ve noticed fewer rabbits across the countryside that might be due to a killer pandemic that has appeared on Britain’s shores. Henry Williams raises awareness in the magazine this week about Rabbit Haemorrhagic Disease (RHD), which has a mortality rate of between 70 and 100% and has already left rabbits endangered in countries like Spain. The disease can kill suddenly and is particularly prolific within wild rabbits, which are less likely to be vaccinated than household pets. How concerned should we be? Henry joined the podcast to discuss. (20:56) And finally: are creme eggs delicious – or disgusting? ‘How do you eat yours?’ asks the famous Cadbury's advert for creme eggs. James Innes-Smith, writing his notes on creme eggs in the magazine this week, responds ‘stamping on them in disgust’. James might not be a fan but most of the British public are – over 220 million of them are sold in the UK each year. Even more astonishing given they’re only available to buy for a third of the year. Why are they loved so much? James joined the podcast alongside The Guardian’s Lucy Mangan, who makes the case for creme eggs. (27:09) Presented by William Moore and Lara Prendergast. Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 17 April 2025

Sam Leith’s guest on this week’s Book Club podcast is the lawyer and writer Philippe Sands, whose new book 38 Londres Street describes the legal and diplomatic tussle over the potential extradition of the former Chilean dictator General Pinochet. Philippe tells Sam why the case was such an important one in legal history, and presents new evidence suggesting that the General’s release to Chile on health grounds may have been part of a behind-the-scenes stitch-up between the UK and Chilean governments. He sets out some of that evidence and pushes back on our reviewer Jonathan Sumption’s scepticism about the case. Here’s an old case, but not yet a cold case. Produced by Oscar Edmondson and Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 16 April 2025

Freddy Gray speaks to Peter Wood who is the President of the National Association of Scholars about Trump's decision to block Harvard funding after the university denied the President's DEI demands. 

Transcribed - Published: 15 April 2025

Lindsey Hilsum is the International Editor for Channel 4 News, where she has worked for over 25 years. Having started her career as an aid worker in Latin America, she transitioned to journalism, and she has now reported from six continents for over three decades. She has covered many major conflicts including Kosovo, Iraq, Syria, Ukraine and across the Middle East during the Arab Spring. Her third book I Brought the War with Me: Stories and Poems from the Front Line is out now. On the podcast Lindsey tells Katy Balls about starting out her career in Guatemala and in Kenya, what it was like being the only English-speaking journalist in Rwanda when the genocide broke out in 1994, and why she is drawn to studying human behaviour in extreme situations. She also talks about her surprising link to flat screen TV technology, how journalism has changed from cutting up clippings from a typewriter to modern open-source intelligence techniques and the place she would most like to travel to – the past. Having always carried a book of poetry with her on her travels, she also reads a favourite included in her new book: The Child at the Window by Siegfried Sassoon.  Produced by Patrick Gibbons. 

Transcribed - Published: 14 April 2025

In Luke's Gospel, an ancient inhabitant of Jerusalem named Simeon meets Mary and Joseph when they bring Jesus to be presented at the Temple on the 40th day after his birth. He has been promised that he will not die until he has seen Christ, and as he takes the baby into his arms he utters the words, 'Lord, now let your servant depart in peace, according to your word; for my eyes have seen your salvation which you have prepared in the presence of all peoples, a light for revelation to the Gentiles, and for glory to your people Israel.'  This prayer, known down the centuries by its opening Latin words Nunc dimittis, explains the title of Quentin Letts's novel Nunc!, a delightfully quirky retelling of the story of Simeon and his friends. It's framed by the experience of a 21st-century corduroy-wearing Englishman who, after receiving bad news about his cancer, wanders into his local cathedral and hears the Nunc dimittis sung at evensong. In this episode of Holy Smoke, Quentin touches on the real-life inspiration for his tale – and suggests to Damian Thompson that old Simeon, venerated as a saint, might be the first Christian in recorded history.  Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 13 April 2025

Globalisation's obituary has been written many times before but, with the turmoil caused over the past few weeks with Donald Trump's various announcements on tariffs, could this mark the beginning of the end for the economic order as we know it? Tej Parikh from the Financial Times and Kate Andrews, The Spectator's deputy US editor, join economics editor Michael Simmons to make the case for why globalisation will outlive Trump. Though, as the US becomes one of the most protectionist countries in the developed world, how much damage has been done to the reputation of the US? And to what extent do governments need to adapt? Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 12 April 2025

On this week’s Spectator Out Loud: Petroc Trelawny reads his diary for the week (1:14); Gareth Roberts wants us to make book jackets nasty again (6:22); Tom Lee writes in defence of benzodiazepines (13:44); Leyla Sanai reflects on unethical practices within psychiatry, as she reviews Jon Stock’s The Sleep Room (19:41); and, Iram Ramzan provides her notes on cousin marriages (24:30).  Produced and presented by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 11 April 2025

This week: Trump’s tariffs – madness or mastermind? ‘Shock tactics’ is the headline of our cover article this week, as deputy editor Freddy Gray reflects on a week that has seen the US President upend the global economic order, with back and forth announcements on reciprocal and retaliatory tariffs. At the time of writing, a baseline 10% on imports stands – with higher tariffs remaining for China, Mexico and Canada. The initial announcement last week had led to the biggest global market decline since the start of the pandemic, and left countries scrambling to react, whether through negotiation or retaliation. China announced a second wave of retaliatory tariffs – to 84% – and Trump, while softening his stance towards other countries, appeared to lean in to a trade war with China by announcing a further hike to 125%. As Freddy writes, for Trump and his supporters ‘China is America’s chief enemy.’ ‘President Trump just took a massive punch at Xi, right in the chops,’ said Steve Bannon. ‘The overlords of easy money, the sociopathic overlords that run Wall Street, the globalist corporatists and the apartheid state of Silicon Valley – all of them combined are the partners of the Chinese Communist party.’ But, as Freddy asks in the magazine, is there method in the madness? Freddy joined the podcast to discuss alongside the financial journalist and Spectator contributor Michael Lynn. (1:35) Next: should cousin marriages be banned? Cousin marriage has been back in the news since the Conservative MP Richard Holden proposed banning the practice. Much of the debate has focused on the British Pakistani community where marriage between cousins is less taboo than other communities within the UK. But, as Iram Ramzan writes in the magazine this week, marriage between cousins has been legal in the UK stretching back to Henry VIII. The dictator Saddam Hussein, the musician Jerry Lee Lewis and even the father of evolution Charles Darwin are surprising examples of people who married their first cousins. Iram writes that it was to her horror that her family suggested she marry her second cousin. To what extent is the law the right recourse to deter cousin marriage? And what are the cultural, ethical, as well as genetic, considerations? Iram joined the podcast alongside Dominic Wilkinson, professor of medical ethics at the University of Oxford. (18:09) And finally: restaurant thefts are rising – why? The Spectator’s food columnist Olivia Potts explores how restaurants are facing a rising problem of theft. Gordon Ramsay’s latest restaurant suffered a £2,000 loss in one week for example. from theft. And, as many as 17 million Britons say they have stolen from a pub or restaurant. Why do they do it? And why is restaurant theft a particular problem now? Liv joined us to discuss further, alongside an anonymous contributor who agreed to share their own experience of stealing from restaurants. (29:57) Presented by William Moore and Lara Prendergast. Produced by Patrick Gibbons and Oscar Edmondson.

Transcribed - Published: 10 April 2025

My guest on this week's Book Club podcast is Fara Dabhoiwala, whose new book What Is Free Speech? The History of a Dangerous Idea looks not just at the origins of free speech as an idea, but also its uses and misuses. Fara tells me the bizarre story of how he found himself ‘cancelled’, gives us the scoop on who actually invented free speech and explains how to think more deeply about free speech as a global as well as a local question – by tracing how we got into our current predicaments.

Transcribed - Published: 9 April 2025

Global financial markets are experiencing significant declines following the announcement of new tariffs by President Trump. These tariffs led to widespread panic among investors and sparked debates about their potential impact on the economy.​ In this episode of Americano, host Freddy Gray is joined by Joe Weisenthal, co-host of Bloomberg’s Odd Lots podcast, to discuss the ramifications of these tariffs. They delve into the immediate market reactions, including a brief $4 trillion surge driven by a misinterpreted news clip, and analyse the underlying motives and potential consequences of the administration's trade policies. 

Transcribed - Published: 8 April 2025

Gok Wan is a renowned stylist and television presenter. Over the years, Gok has transformed the way we think about style and body image with his much-loved series How to Look Good Naked and Gok’s Fashion Fix – his focus on body positivity was the antidote to the crash-dieting fads which dominated the 2000s. Later in his career, Gok drew upon his Chinese heritage to author books on Chinese cooking. On the podcast he tells Liv and Lara about growing up in a Chinese restaurant, why hosting is more like ‘theatre’ and why he always abides by the five-second rule.

Transcribed - Published: 8 April 2025

** Chinese Whispers is coming to an end. Later this year, Cindy Yu will be joining The Times and The Sunday Times to write a regular column on China. To stay abreast of her latest work, subscribe to her free Substack at chinesewhispers.substack.com ** The term ‘old friend of the Chinese people’ might seem a colloquial, almost sentimental, phrase to appear in official diplomatic language, but in the Chinese context, those words have a very specific meaning. Most often, they refer to high profile foreigners whose actions have helped the Chinese Communist Party in one way or another. The most famous of these is Henry Kissinger, who led the way for American rapprochement with China. That the CCP gives various foreigners this honour is revealing of China’s priorities over the decades, but also of its attempts to co-opt foreign forces to its cause. Think back to the United Front strategy, which we looked at on the podcast earlier in the year. To discuss this honorific, Cindy is joined Professor Anne-Marie Brady, a China expert at the University of Canterbury in New Zealand, who was among the first to look at China’s old friends as a serious political concept some 20 years ago, and Ryan Ho Kilpatrick, a journalist based in Hong Kong.

Transcribed - Published: 7 April 2025

Katie Lam was elected as a new Conservative MP, for Weald of Kent, at the 2024 election. While studying at Cambridge she was president of the Cambridge Union and chairman of the Conservative Association, and she was later a special advisor – first under Boris Johnson in the business unit at Number 10, and then later working on counterterrorism with Suella Braverman. In between university and politics, she worked at Goldman Sachs and at AI-specialists Faculty, and she is also an accomplished lyricist and scriptwriter having co-written five musicals. She was appointed a Tory assistant whip last year when Kemi Badenoch took over as leader.   On the podcast, Katie talks to Katy Balls about attending Tory party conference with her dad, what Katy calls the ‘chief prefect vibes’ of her CV and whether investment banking or politics is more cutthroat. Having started at Number 10 in 2019, she also talks about the highs and lows at the end of the Brexit negotiations and why the pandemic will probably be the hardest moment of her professional career – plus a mention of that incident with Dilyn the dog. Having a great-great grandfather who was a socialist politician and fierce critic of the Nazis, and who had to flee persecution, she also opens up about her family’s influence on her politics and her values.  Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 7 April 2025

On this week’s Spectator Out Loud: Gavin Mortimer looks at how the French right can still win (1:48); Colin Freeman interviews Americans who have fought in Ukraine and feel betrayed by Trump (11:01); Lawrence Osborne details his experience of last week’s earthquake, as he reads his diary from Bangkok (18:38); Lionel Shriver defends traditional, monogamous marriage (24:07); and, Anthony Cummins examines media satire and settled scores as he reviews Natasha Brown’s Universality (31:13).  Produced and presented by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 6 April 2025

Marine Le Pen, president of Rassemblement National (National Rally) was found guilty this week of embezzling EU funds to boost her party’s finances. The guilty verdict was widely expected, however her sentence was far harsher than even her strongest critics expected – part of which saw her banned from standing for office for five years, with immediate effect. Le Pen had been the favourite to win the next French presidential election in 2027. Pursuing Donald Trump through the courts was widely seen as backfiring as he went on to win the presidential election, and many have argued that there is a double standard with many more figures and parties facing investigation from the right than from the left. Is this a case of justice served, or another example of creeping lawfare across the West? Deputy political editor James Heale discusses with our deputy editor Freddy Gray and French journalist and writer Anne-Elisabeth Moutet.  Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 5 April 2025

President Donald Trump has announced sweeping new tariffs, including a 10 per cent duty on all UK exports to the United States, as part of his 'Reciprocal Tariffs' plan aimed at addressing trade imbalances and bolstering American manufacturing. This move is expected to impact approximately £60 billion worth of UK exports, with sectors such as automotive and Scotch whisky facing significant challenges. The UK government, while relieved to have avoided higher tariffs imposed on other nations, is now navigating the potential economic repercussions and exploring avenues for negotiation. ​ Freddy Gray speaks with William Clouston, leader of the Social Democratic Party (SDP), to analyse the implications of Trump's tariff announcement on the UK economy.

Transcribed - Published: 4 April 2025

This week: Starmerism’s moral vacuum ‘Governments need a mission, or they descend into reactive incoherence’ writes Michael Gove in this week’s cover piece. A Labour government, he argues, ‘cannot survive’ without a sense of purpose. The ‘failure of this government to make social justice its mission’ has led to a Spring Statement ‘that was at once hurried, incoherent and cruel – a fiscal drive-by shooting’.  Michael writes that Starmer wishes to emulate his hero – the post-war Prime Minister Clement Atlee, who founded the NHS and supported a fledgling NATO alliance. Yet, with policy driven by Treasury mandarins, the Labour project is in danger of drifting, as John Major’s premiership did. Starmerism’s policy vacuum is being filled so rapidly by HMT that we are embarking on an era of ‘cruel Labour’.  Michael joined the podcast to discuss further, alongside John McTernan, former private secretary to Tony Blair. (1:37) Next: have the Church’s sacred spaces become community clubs? From yoga classes to drag shows, and even a helter-skelter, the Revd Dr Jamie Franklin, host of the podcast Irreverentand author of The Great Return, writes in the magazine this week about what he argues is the ‘tragic misuse of its sacred spaces’ by the Church of England. This new reality may be symptomatic of a wider issue with the leadership of the Church, currently pondering its future. The journalist Quentin Letts provides his own manifesto for the next Archbishop of Canterbury in this week’s diary.  So do diverse uses of space broaden the Church’s appeal or does it run the risk of diluting its holiness? Quentin, whose new book NUNC! Is out now, joined the podcast alongside Jamie to discuss. (20:52) And finally: is Clandon Park a visionary restoration or a catastrophic precedent? Calvin Po addresses the ‘conundrum of conservation’ in the Arts lead for the magazine this week: how much of a building can be restored before it becomes a different building entirely?  Plans have moved forward for the 18th century Palladian mansion Clandon Park, managed by the National Trust, to be preserved in a half-charred form, following its gutting by fire in 2015. The Trust says this ‘approach combines careful conservation, scholarly restoration and sensitive contemporary design’. And The Society for the Protection of Ancient Buildings (SPAB), founded by William Morris, has hailed the plans, arguing that a full restoration would amount to a ‘feeble and lifeless forgery’ and the ‘Clandon of the future will offer a markedly different visitor experience to that of the past, but one that will have its own interest’. Calvin, however, worries that this sets a ‘catastrophic precedent’ for restorations of the future, and The Georgian Group actively opposed the Trust’s proposal, arguing that the building’s merit comes in its original design ‘not in burnt bricks’.  To discuss further we were joined by The Georgian Group’s director Dr Anya Lucas, and the architectural historian – and former Chair of SPAB – Gillian Darley. (35:17) Presented by William Moore and Lara Prendergast. Produced by Patrick Gibbons and Oscar Edmondson.

Transcribed - Published: 3 April 2025

Freddy is joined by James Fishback – writer, investor and chief executive of investment firm Azoria – on ‘Liberation Day’, when Donald Trump is set to announce a raft of new tariffs (at 9 p.m. UK time). They discuss the impact of Trump’s tariffs on the market, whether this marks the upending of the neoliberal economic world order, or if Donald Trump is just a tough negotiator.

Transcribed - Published: 2 April 2025

My guest in this week’s Book Club podcast is the poet and novelist Joe Dunthorne, who is here to talk about his new non-fiction book Children of Radium: A Buried Inheritance. In it, he describes how he criss-crossed Europe in search of the truth about his great-grandfather, a Jewish scientist who found himself working on chemical weapons for the Nazis. Joe talks to me about historical guilt, the accidents of fate and human psychology – and making comedy out of tragedy.

Transcribed - Published: 2 April 2025

The former Archbishop of Canterbury, Justin Welby, is back in the news following his interview this week with the BBC's Laura Kuenssberg. The interview – his first since he resigned last November – was clearly Welby's attempt to draw a line under the abuse scandal that cost him his job.  The 2024 Makin report concluded that the Church of England missed many opportunities to investigate the late John Smyth, one of the most prolific abusers associated with the Anglican Church. However, the biggest headline from the interview was that Welby would 'forgive' John Smyth were he alive today. Albeit unintentionally, the former Archbishop of Canterbury ended up cementing his reputation as an inflexible micro-manager with a tin ear for the views of abuse survivors and his own clergy.  Where does the interview leave the Church of England? The appointees to the Crown Nominations Committee, the body which will consider the successor to Welby, will soon be known. How should this scandal influence them? And, with mounting reports that Pope Francis has shielded Catholic sexual predators, how does the handling of abuse allegations by Canterbury and Rome compare? The Rev Fergus Butler-Gallie, Vicar of Charlbury in Oxfordshire and the editor-at-large of The Fence magazine, joins Damian Thompson to discuss the abuse crises that seem to be engulfing all the mainstream Churches.  Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 1 April 2025

The Spectator's columnist Douglas Murray joins Freddy Gray to discuss his recent column on why the JFK conspiracies just won't die. They also discuss the moon landing, the emergence of American self-hatred, and the return of the post-truth era.

Transcribed - Published: 1 April 2025

Kim Leadbeater has been an MP since winning the Batley & Spen by-election for Labour in 2021. She was elected to the constituency that her sister, Jo Cox, had served until she was murdered during the 2016 Brexit referendum campaign. Having pursued a career in health and fitness, Kim hadn’t initially intended on a life in politics, but she went on to champion social and political cohesion through the Jo Cox Foundation and the More in Common initiative. More recently, she has led the campaign to legalise Assisted Dying. The Bill is currently making its way through Parliament and has been described as the biggest social reform in a generation.  On the podcast, Kim talks to Katy Balls about finding common ground with other Yorkshire MPs (including one former Prime Minister), why she thinks the growing popularity of Reform is a worrying sign of disillusionment in politics, and how she is more likely to retire than pursue a third career. The debate around Assisted Dying has been more ‘unpleasant’ than expected but she has no regrets, and thinks that – most importantly – the national conversation around death has moved on. Despite a proposed extension, Kim hopes the Bill – if passed – will be implemented within 2-3 years. Produced by Patrick Gibbons. 

Transcribed - Published: 31 March 2025

On this week’s Spectator Out Loud: Owen Matthews argues that Turkish President Erdogan’s position is starting to look shaky (1:19); James Heale examines the new party of the posh: the Lib Dems (7:51); Francis Pike highlights the danger Chinese hypersonic missiles pose to the US navy (13:54); Christian House highlights Norway’s occupation during the Second World War, as he reviews Robert Ferguson’s book Norway’s War (22:01); and, Mark Mason provides his notes on coins (28:18).    Produced and presented by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 30 March 2025

An MP for 35 years, Michael Heseltine served as Environment Secretary and then Defence Secretary in Margaret Thatcher’s government. Following his well-publicised resignation in 1986, he returned to government under John Major and was Deputy Prime Minister for the last two years of Major’s premiership. Once seen as a potential successor to Thatcher and Major, he has sat in the Lords since stepping down as an MP in 2001, and in recent years has been an outspoken critic of Brexit. Lord Heseltine sits down with James Heale to discuss his thoughts on the current Labour government, how to fix Britain’s broken economy and why devolution should go further. ‘Deeply depressed’ by attacks on the civil service – Britain’s ‘rolls royce’ – he provides his thoughts on various political leaders: Starmer is handling Trump well, Reeves is handling the economy badly, Badenoch is being overshadowed by foreign affairs, and Boris Johnson demonstrated he has ‘no integrity’. And on Thatcher, he says new information has vindicated him over the Westland affair and demonstrated her ‘complicity’. His new book, From Acorns to Oaks: An Urgent Agenda to Rebuild Britain, is out now. Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 29 March 2025

A greatly enfeebled Pope Francis is now living in enforced isolation in a suite at his Santa Marta residence that has been converted into hospital accommodation. He won't be resuming public duties for two months, we are told – and even his senior advisors have limited access to him. As a result, it's really not clear who is in charge of the Catholic Church. And, as Damian Thompson reports in this episode of Holy Smoke, it's by no means clear when this paralysis will end; it's significant that there has been so little talk of the Pope making a full recovery. Meanwhile, Cardinal Pietro Parolin, the Secretary of State who isn't bothering to hide his ambition to succeed Francis, is continuing to forge alliances... Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 28 March 2025

Join Katy Balls, Michael Gove, Lord Glasman, Lord Frost and pollster James Kanagasooriam as they unpack the highly anticipated Spring Statement and its implications for national policy and global security. Listen for: Michael’s plan for how to deal with the Donald, and why the Treasury is not fit for purpose; Maurice on his influence in the White House, and what's wrong with the current political class; David’s reflections on why Brexit was ahead of its time; and James’s explanation for Britain’s lost sense of community.

Transcribed - Published: 28 March 2025

This week: welcome to the age of the strongman ‘The world’s most exclusive club… is growing,’ writes Paul Wood in this week’s Spectator. Membership is restricted to a very select few: presidents-for-life. Putin of Russia, Xi of China, Kim of North Korea and MBS of Saudi Arabia are being joined by Erdogan of Turkey – who is currently arresting his leading domestic political opponent – and Donald Trump, who ‘openly admires such autocrats and clearly wants to be one himself’. ‘This is the age of the strongman,’ Wood declares, ‘and the world is far more dangerous because of it.’ Despite their bombast, these ‘are often troubled characters’, products of difficult childhoods. But ‘the real danger’ lies in their ‘grandiose plans’ and ‘wish to secure their place in history by redrawing the map’ whether over Ukraine, Taiwan or even Greenland. What drives them, and how worried should we be? Paul joined the podcast alongside the Financial Times journalist, and author of The Age of the Strongman, Gideon Rachman. (1:01) Next: Tesla owners, beware! Jonathan Miller writes in the magazine this week about the phenomenon of Tesla cars being defaced, damaged, and even set fire to. The brand’s association with its owner Elon Musk has made it an ‘accessible but indefensible’ target for activists. And, despite Musk’s role in the Trump administration, this issue isn’t confined to the US. Jonathan joined the podcast from his hamlet in the south of France to talk about how local Tesla-owners are preparing to fight back. A representative from the activist group Tesla Takedown did initially accept an invitation to join the podcast…  (15:50) And finally: are theatre matinees experiencing a revival? Playwright Jonathan Maitland highlights the resurgent popularity of theatre matinees in the arts lead of the magazine. Matinees have a long history within theatre and now offer a greater convenience for diverse audiences in a post-pandemic age. Jonathan’s new play, Wilko: Love and Death and Rock n Roll, is a good example of this. At London’s Southwark Playhouse until the 19th April, they’ve put on extra matinee performances to cope with demand (a small number of tickets are still available).  Jonathan joined the podcast alongside Nica Burns, the theatre producer and co-owner of the Nimax Theatres group which runs six West End theatres including the Palace, the Apollo and the Garrick. (22:25) Presented by William Moore and Lara Prendergast. Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 27 March 2025

My guest in this week’s Book Club is Francesca Simon. Best known for her Horrid Henry series of children’s books, Francesca has just published her first novel for grownups, a haunting reworking of a Welsh folk tale called Salka: Lady of the Lake. She tells me how she came to shift direction, what myths offer in terms of storytelling possibility – and why she never tired of her best-known creation.

Transcribed - Published: 26 March 2025

Jeffrey Goldberg’s story in the Atlantic is so mind-blowing it’s hard to know what to say in response. It defies belief that Donald Trump’s National Security Adviser, Mike Waltz, appears to have accidentally added a top journalist to a Signal messaging group with senior government officials – including the Vice President, Secretary of State, Defence Secretary and the Director of National Intelligence – to discuss top-secret military action. It boggles the brain that the people running the most powerful country on the planet, the Principals Committee of US national security no less, use childish emojis to discuss a bombing campaign which they helped co-ordinate in order to kill 53 people. It’s another painful reminder that, whether Trump or Biden is in the White House, the free world is not being led by serious people. Deputy and US editor Freddy Gray is joined by Ben Domenech, editor-at-large of Spectator World, to discuss. You can watch this episode on YouTube! Click here.

Transcribed - Published: 25 March 2025

Loyd Grossman is a man of many talents: from appearing on our screens as the host of MasterChef and Through the Keyhole, to crafting a beloved line of pasta sauces. Loyd has left his mark on both the culinary and cultural worlds. On the podcast, Loyd talks to Lara about hazy memories of ‘sipping a Shirley Temple cocktail aged 6 or 7’, the secret behind his pasta sauces, and why he loathes school meals. 

Transcribed - Published: 25 March 2025

** Chinese Whispers is coming to an end. Later this year, Cindy Yu will be joining The Times and The Sunday Times to write a regular column on China. To stay abreast of her latest work, subscribe to her free Substack at chinesewhispers.substack.com ** It’s easy to forget that, as recently as the start of this century, the US was China’s biggest ally. Washington saw Beijing as a necessary bulwark against Moscow, and consistently supported China’s entry into the world economy ever since rapprochement in the 1970s, including its accession to the World Trade Organisation. These days, the relationship couldn’t be more different. Why have relations cooled quite so fast? When was the turning point? And can we now say that rapprochement was a strategic mistake from the US? Bob Davis is a former senior editor at the Wall Street Journal, who was posted to China between 2011 and 2014. In recent years, he has been conducting a long running series of interviews - with dozens of high level officials over successive American administrations - for the online magazine, The Wire China. He has interviewed defense secretaries, ambassadors, national security advisors, treasury secretaries and more. Now, these interviews have been collated into a new e-book released by The Wire China: Broken Engagement. Through these interviews, we can see the changing direction of US-China relations through the eyes and words of those at the very heart of America’s decisions. Bob joins this episode.

Transcribed - Published: 24 March 2025

Caroline Lucas was elected as the first ever MP for the Green Party and served as their leader three times. Having completed a PhD in English, worked for Oxfam, and been involved in local Green Party politics, she went on to serve in the European Parliament for a decade. In 2010, she was elected to Parliament as the MP for Brighton Pavilion and, during her 14 years in Westminster, the Green Party went from 0.9% of the national vote to 6.4%. Although she stepped down, a record 4 Green Party MPs were elected at the 2024 election. On the podcast - the 150th episode of Women With Balls - Caroline tells Katy Balls about growing up with different politics to her Conservative-voting parents, why her views on nuclear weapons haven’t changed, and whether the left can be patriotic. She also talks about being a peer of Nigel Farage in Brussels, what it’s like being the sole parliamentary party representative, and why she never considered joining the Labour Party. She argues that there is a political urgency for the left to discuss ‘Englishness’, as outlined in her bestselling book Another England: How To Reclaim Our National Story, which is available now in paperback.  Produced by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 24 March 2025

On this week’s Spectator Out Loud: Henry Jeffreys looks at the potential impact of Trump’s tariffs on British drinkers (1:31); on the 400th anniversary of Charles I’s accession to the throne, Marcus Walker explains what modern Britain could learn from the cavalier monarch (7:10); Angus Colwell provides his notes on beef dripping (13:55); Nicolas Farrell reveals he refused to accept the local equivalent of an Oscar (16:40); and, Rory Sutherland makes the case for linking VAT to happiness… with 0% going to pubs, Indian restaurants and cheddar cheese (24:08).  Produced and presented by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 23 March 2025

On 23 March 2020, then-Prime Minister Boris Johnson announced the unprecedented decision to put the UK into lockdown. To mark the 5th anniversary of that announcement this weekend, we have brought together our editor Michael Gove – then a cabinet minister under Boris – and our associate editor Toby Young – an ardent critic of the decision – to answer the question, was the government right to lock down? Was the decision a necessary and reasonable health measure based on the available evidence at the time, or a significant and avoidable violation of civil liberties by a government that was meant to champion liberal freedoms? You decide. Produced and presented by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 22 March 2025

On 23 March 2020, then-Prime Minister Boris Johnson announced the unprecedented decision to put the UK into lockdown. To mark the 5th anniversary of that announcement this weekend, we have brought together our editor Michael Gove – then a cabinet minister under Boris – and our associate editor Toby Young – an ardent critic of the decision – to answer the question, was the government right to lock down? Was the decision a necessary and reasonable health measure based on the available evidence at the time, or a significant and avoidable violation of civil liberties by a government that was meant to champion liberal freedoms? You decide. Produced and presented by Patrick Gibbons.

Transcribed - Published: 22 March 2025