The "What is Money?" Show

Michael Kelly returns for Part 3 of our deep dive into Nassim Taleb’s “Antifragile.” We explore how collaboration creates nonlinear upside, why decentralized planning outperforms top-down control, and how creative destruction drives innovation over time. We discuss Taleb’s views on risk, volatility, and Bitcoin, consider why ethics and transformation require skin in the game, and observe how time is the ultimate judge. Michael J Kelly III, is a producer and creative strategist with a passion for natural science and the intersection of politics and biology.

Transcribed - Published: 1 July 2025

What does it mean to be antifragile, and why does Bitcoin fit the definition better than anything else? Michael Kelly returns to continue our discussion of Nassim Taleb’s “Antifragile”: we explore the gap between invention and implementation, the arrogance of academic models, the elegance of Bitcoin’s design, the difference between “street-smarts” and “book-smarts, the role of leisure in driving progress, and how true antifragility emerges through practice, not theory. Michael J Kelly III, is a producer and creative strategist with a passion for natural science and the intersection of politics and biology.

Transcribed - Published: 27 June 2025

What if hitting rock bottom was the best thing that ever happened to you? Michael Ruiz shares his transformative journey through faith, divorce, psychedelics, and Bitcoin. We explore extreme ownership, ego death, ayahuasca experiences, spiritual awakening, the individual vs the state, orange-pilling loved ones, and how Bitcoin can help us navigate the meaning crisis. Michael Ruiz is an entrepreneur and founder of “The Sovereign Mindset” who is navigating the transition from Fiat to Sound Money.

Transcribed - Published: 25 June 2025

What if your deepest desires aren’t even your own? Chris Vasquez and I explore the four types of freedom: financial, time, location, and inner. We discuss how to escape the hedonic treadmill, mentally rehearse who you want to be, use gratitude to rewire your brain, and separate memetic desire from authentic drive. Chris shares his advice for getting rich, investing in yourself, spotting A players, understanding the voids that shape our values, untangling self-worth from identity, and walking the three paths to enlightenment. Chris Vasquez is a tech investor, entrepreneur, and host of the “World Class Podcast.”

Transcribed - Published: 20 June 2025

Lyn Alden joins me to explore the evolution of money, ledger money vs token money, why gold won the commodity war, and the unified theory of money. We discuss why gold failed to scale, how the telegraph sped up information but not final settlement, how inflation distorts both markets and minds, and how Bitcoin will change the world. Lyn Alden is an investor, best-selling author of “Broken Money”, and worldwide speaker with a focus on the intersection of money and technology.

Transcribed - Published: 18 June 2025

Ivan Makedonski joins us to explore the idea of “digit addiction”, if Bitcoin’s survival depends on it scaling as a medium of exchange, and how money reflects back our deepest emotional patterns. We discuss the importance of a standard unit of measurement, the value of legacy planning, and the physics of power projection, showing how Bitcoin realigns human cooperation, reshapes capitalism, and forces us to rebuild the user experience from first principles. Ivan Makedonski is a contributor to Bitcoin Magazine and currently building “Breez”, which helps bring Bitcoin Lightning Payments to every app.

Transcribed - Published: 13 June 2025

Eric V Stacks joins me to share his orange pill journey and how Bitcoin opened his eyes to the insanity of the current fiat clown world. We talk about new content coming to the WiM ecosystem, including Eric’s weekly show where he breaks down key Bitcoin events, current narratives, and the deeper principles driving the movement. We also explore what it means to BTC, “Be The Change”, and why Bitcoin isn’t a threat, but the foundation for a freer, more honest world. Eric V Stacks is a former cannabis producer turned Bitcoin advocate and WiM co-host.

Transcribed - Published: 11 June 2025

Saifedean Ammous joins me to explore the core principles of Austrian economics, how time preference shapes personal growth, and why cooperation depends on delayed gratification. We connect the dots between morality, money printing, and civilizational decline, and show how Bitcoin realigns incentives toward regeneration and stability. Saifedean Ammous is an economist, professor, and best selling author of “The Bitcoin Standard”, “The Fiat Standard”, “Fiat Food”, and “Principles of Economics.”

Transcribed - Published: 9 June 2025

Sad Oshi joins me to explore the collapse of economic trust and the return to quality through Bitcoin. We discuss how LLMs mimic human pattern recognition, the tradeoff between data and energy, the merging of artificial and natural systems, Neuralink and our coming “cyborg future,” the great awakening ahead, and how to find meaning in an increasingly synthetic world. Sad Oshi is a bitcoin only focused technologist and engineer.

Transcribed - Published: 6 June 2025

Henry Shi joins me to explore the rise of artificial intelligence, the basics of neural nets and context windows, and the technology driving today’s models. We break down what it takes to build a billion-dollar AI company, the “DeepSeek vs Open AI moment,” lean AI business models, why every company may soon be an AI company, and how to prepare yourself for the rapidly approaching AI future. Henry Shi is a technology entrepreneur and co-founder and former COO/CTO of Super.com.

Transcribed - Published: 4 June 2025

Henry Shi joins me to explore the rise of artificial intelligence, the basics of neural nets and context windows, and the technology driving today’s models. We break down what it takes to build a billion-dollar AI company, the “DeepSeek vs Open AI moment,” lean AI business models, why every company may soon be an AI company, and how to prepare yourself for the rapidly approaching AI future. Henry Shi is a technology entrepreneur and co-founder and former COO/CTO of Super.com.

Transcribed - Published: 4 June 2025

I join Bram Kanstein to explore how Bitcoin reflects nature’s deeper truths, emerging as a force of order in a chaotic world. We discuss the role of adversity, the laws of physics, the distinction between decentralization and centralization, how Bitcoin aligns with nature’s design, why truth and entropy shape financial systems, how fiat distorts family planning, and why Bitcoin may be a self-fulfilling prophecy built into the very fabric of reality.

Transcribed - Published: 2 June 2025

Stephen Diangelo joins me to explore how money printing functions as a collective addiction, distorting truth and reshaping our relationship with reality. We discuss the difference between habits and addiction, the spiritual consequences of self-deception, the central bank as a devouring mother, the tension between lies and radical truth, the role of the price signal in human coordination, and why facing addiction may be the first step toward answering the deeper call within.

Transcribed - Published: 30 May 2025

Matt Manning joins me to explore how Bitcoin represents a revolution in human consciousness, reshaping how we think, feel, and relate to one another. We discuss meditation, ego death, the role of breath in overcoming overthinking, the tension between ideology and enlightenment, the spiritual dimension of money, how the self is a story, and why Bitcoin may be the unity of opposites. Matt Manning is a consultant who offers private 1:1 work for leaders on the edge of Bitcoin, Decentralization, Consciousness, Wisdom, and The Liminal Leap.

Transcribed - Published: 27 May 2025

Jesse Meyers joins me to explore the origins of money as a once-in-a-species breakthrough in human coordination, how scarcity forms the basis of moral structure, and why money serves as the keystone of civilization. We discuss the evolution of money across history, the development of tools and natural language, how Bitcoin has perfected scarcity, why Bitcoin is a self-fulfilling prophecy, and the bright orange future ahead. Jesse Myers is the co-founder and COO of Onramp, a Bitcoin financial services company, built on Multi-Institution Custody.

Transcribed - Published: 23 May 2025

Paul Saladino joins me to explore the dynamics of intrasexual competition, how modern men are civilizing themselves to death, the effect of Botox and plastic surgery on empathy and emotional expression, the connection between sunburn and seed oils, and the overlooked risks of TRT, peptides, and methylene blue. Paul shares his views on fasted training, breaking coffee addiction, red light therapy, and why you should break the unhealthy cycle of modern life by taking a “heroic dose” of nature. Paul Saladino is a double-board certified doctor, podcaster, author and creator of the animal-based diet.

Transcribed - Published: 20 May 2025

Jordan Hall joins me to explore the nature of the State, the collapse of formal institutions, why civilization is best understood as a living, cognitive organism, symbolic depth vs symbolic endurance, why Bitcoin enables “nations without states” by rearchitecting trust on a global scale, Bitcoin and the “Sovereign Individual” thesis, the role of Christ in revelation, and the role of proof-of-work blockchains in aligning civilization with truth. Jordan Hall, is a futurist, philosopher, and public speaker renowned for his insights into the interplay between technology and culture.

Transcribed - Published: 16 May 2025

David Sutcliffe joins me to explore the unconscious patterns driving our behavior, how shadow work helps us reclaim lost parts of ourselves, why courage is the gateway to transformation, and how Bitcoin lowers the profitability of coercion by rewriting the rules of power from the ground up. David also shares his “Graybeard Commandments” for young men, his journey down the Bitcoin rabbit hole, and how radical truth is the only way to live free in a world built on lies. David Sutcliffe is a former actor and current life coach and Core Energetics Practitioner

Transcribed - Published: 14 May 2025

Paul Keating joins me to explore the parallels between surfing and Bitcoin, the power of fear-setting, why holding the keys to your speech on Nostr is critical, and how Bitcoin Jungle proves the Bitcoin standard works in the real world. We cover the falling cost of living in a deflationary future, how Bitcoin and Nostr fix play, and how they help build a life of truth, freedom, digital minimalism, and ethical maximalism. Paul Keating is the head of growth at Primal and a surfer living in the Bitcoin Jungle of Costa Rica.

Transcribed - Published: 12 May 2025

Richard Werner joins me to explore the hidden history of the U.S. dollar, the origins of tally sticks as early money, and how interest rates, central planning, and price fixing distort real economic growth. We discuss the rise of central banks as banking cartels, the history of Viking influence on European civilization, and the creation of the petrodollar. Richard Andreas Werner is a German banking and development economist who is a university professor at University of Winchester.

Transcribed - Published: 9 May 2025

Eric Yakes joins me to explore the dimensions of money, the consolidation of centralized fiat power, and why Bitcoin is the antidote to our corrupted financial and academic institutions. We discuss the morality embedded in Bitcoin’s design, why evolution is nature’s version of free market innovation, the physics of sound money, the addiction of money printing, how Bitcoin unlocks a global energy bounty, and the connection between Bitcoin, wisdom, religion, and tradition. Eric Yakes is the Founder and Managing Partner at Epoch VC, a Bitcoin venture capital firm.

Transcribed - Published: 6 May 2025

Eric V Stacks joins me to explore how cannabis became a threat to the state, why humans and plants evolved together, why Bitcoin and cannabis share a grassroots adoption path, how financial brainwashing distorts our perception of reality, why Bitcoin aligns individual and collective incentives, how psychedelics and Bitcoin unlock metacognition, the power of gratitude through suffering, and why Bitcoin is a software update for human consciousness. Eric V Stacks is a professional cannabis farmer and Bitcoin advocate.

Transcribed - Published: 2 May 2025

Andrew Macdonald joins me to explore Natural Law, the difference between consent and coercion, and how language shapes the legal and financial systems we live under. We discuss the founding of the Federal Reserve, why a private bank controls our money, and how reclaiming personal sovereignty begins by understanding the rules of the game. Andrew Macdonald is an advocate of equity jurisprudence and commercial remedies renowned for his expertise in teaching individuals how to effectively discharge tax debts, mortgages, student loans, COVID-related loans, credit cards, and other financial obligations.

Transcribed - Published: 30 April 2025

Chase Hughes joins me to explore how behavioral science can help us understand human nature, the origins of social anxiety, the power of focusing on others, building intuition to detect incongruent behavior, and how to handle online criticism and manipulation. We dive into the consequences of concealed shame, the value of radical truth and forgiving yourself, the psychology behind money printing and propaganda, the basics of interrogation, and how mind control has shaped modern society. Chase Hughes is founder and CEO of Applied Behavior Research. He is a leading behavior expert, and author of the three-year #1 bestselling book on persuasion, influence and behavior profiling, The Ellipsis Manual.

Transcribed - Published: 28 April 2025

Richard Werner joins me to explore what money really is, how the Federal Reserve infiltrated academia, how central banks have shaped modern economics, why money does not originate from government, the rise of gold and fractional reserve banking, the history of monetary conquest and credit cycles, the bursting of the Japanese real estate bubble, and the moral hazards of central banking. Richard Andreas Werner is a German banking and development economist who is a university professor at University of Winchester.

Transcribed - Published: 25 April 2025

Jeff Booth joins me to explore why inflation is the greatest lie ever told, how inflationary money is incompatible with technology, how Bitcoin aligns the global supercomputer of humanity, why scarcity is the starting point of morality, Bitcoin as the first true free market, why money is superordinate to law, the importance of Bitcoin scaling as a medium of exchange, and the path to an abundant future built on sound money. Jeff Booth is an entrepreneur, author of “The Price of Tomorrow”, and a founding partner at Ego Death Capital.

Transcribed - Published: 23 April 2025

Matt Ridley joins me to explore the evolutionary nature of progress: why no one person can make a computer mouse, how money functions as a form of collective memory, and how ideas, like genes, evolve through exchange. We discuss the role of language, beauty, and costly signaling in shaping human behavior, the parallels between Adam Smith and Charles Darwin, why Bitcoin might be the next phase in the evolution of money, and reflect back on the corruption surrounding Covid, vaccines, and the pandemic response. Matt Ridley is a British science writer, journalist and businessman.

Transcribed - Published: 21 April 2025

Josh Sidman joins me to debate the nature of private property, the legitimacy of land ownership, and the controversial ideas of economist Silvio Gesell. We clash over whether land ownership undermines freedom, if saving can become parasitic in a monetary system, and whether interest is a tool of coordination or coercion. We dig into the philosophical roots of ownership, the role of money in shaping human action, and whether Bitcoin resolves or reinforces the core tensions in our economic system. Josh Sidman is the founder/director at The Silvio Gesell Foundation, former derivatives trader, professional musician, and small business owner.

Transcribed - Published: 18 April 2025

Josh Sidman joins me to debate the nature of private property, the legitimacy of land ownership, and the controversial ideas of economist Silvio Gesell. We clash over whether land ownership undermines freedom, if saving can become parasitic in a monetary system, and whether interest is a tool of coordination or coercion. We dig into the philosophical roots of ownership, the role of money in shaping human action, and whether Bitcoin resolves or reinforces the core tensions in our economic system. Josh Sidman is the founder/director at The Silvio Gesell Foundation, former derivatives trader, professional musician, and small business owner.

Transcribed - Published: 18 April 2025

Andrew Henderson from Nomad Capitalist joins me to discuss the strategy of jurisdictional arbitrage, the process and implications of renouncing U.S. citizenship, the value of accumulating multiple passports, the political and economic shifts impacting American expatriates, what it means to live like a king abroad, and how Nomad Capitalism is a path to sovereignty for individuals.

Transcribed - Published: 15 April 2025

Trey Brahem interviews me to explore the evolution of money, the emergence of money as the foundation of civilization, the psychological and moral consequences of fiat, the difference between wealth and money, why Bitcoin aligns with universal human ends, what the ideal money looks like, and how Bitcoin reintroduces truth, ethics, and sovereignty into a world distorted by debt and deception.

Transcribed - Published: 14 April 2025

CJ Konstantinos joins me to discuss how Bitcoin transforms our understanding of money, why engineered scarcity beats commodity money, and how debt-based systems are driving us toward a global monetary reset. We explore Bitcoin as pristine collateral, the fight against the World Bank and IMF, the ethical failures of fiat incentives, and why Bitcoin adoption may ultimately restore ancient wisdom in a chaotic modern world. CJ Konstantinos is the founder of “People’s Reserve” which is revolutionizing finance by building around Bitcoin equity as the most pristine form of collateral in the world.

Transcribed - Published: 12 April 2025

Geoff Woods joins me to discuss what it means to be an AI-driven leader, how to practically leverage tools like ChatGPT for productivity, and the mindset required to build your future self in an increasingly automated world. We explore startup vs legacy approaches to AI integration, the most valuable skills to master in the AI age, how to future-proof your career, and what the smartest people in the world are doing today to prepare for an AI-driven future. Geoff Woods is the #1 bestselling author of The AI-Driven Leader, host of the AI-Driven Leader podcast, and Founder of AI Leadership and The AI-Driven Leadership Collective, a network of executives collaborating to harness AI to build better businesses and better lives.

Transcribed - Published: 8 April 2025

Dave Birnbaum joins me to discuss why privacy is the most important technical problem in Bitcoin, the tradeoffs between auditability and anonymity, how CoinJoin protects users in a surveillance economy, whether cyberspace is the new frontier, the role of Bitcoin in enabling interplanetary civilization, and how AI and Bitcoin will coordinate to increase human productivity. David Birnbaum is a technology innovator and current VP of Product at Coinbits.app.

Transcribed - Published: 4 April 2025

Tom DiLorenzo joins me to discuss the demonization of capitalism, the spiritual consequences of money printing, the mission of the Mises Institute, why Abraham Lincoln might be a fraud, how the Federal Reserve led to the US joining WWI, the difference between Austrian and Keynesian economics, Bitcoin vs Gold, and what a sound money future could look like. Thomas James DiLorenzo is an American author and former university economics professor who is the President of the Ludwig von Mises Institute.

Transcribed - Published: 1 April 2025

Matt McDonagh joins me to discuss how AI is saving lives, the differences between AGI and LLMs like ChatGPT, the ethics of synthetic consciousness, if Bitcoin was invented or discovered, simulation theory and predicting the future using AI, and why the accelerating rate of technological change demands a new way of thinking about human flourishing. Matt McDonagh is a former Wall St banker turned self-proclaimed Bitcoin nerd, data engineer, and family office investor.

Transcribed - Published: 28 March 2025

Mel Mattison joins me to discuss how AI and quantum computing are breaking traditional investing, Jeff Booth’s deflationary thesis in “The Price of Tomorrow”, Bitcoin’s role in revolting against financial oppression, the risks of compromised ETFs, the geopolitical power struggle between global superpowers, the looming debt doom loop, and why Bitcoin is the solution to the collapsing global monetary system. Mel Mattison is an author, founder, and fintech executive who enjoys exploring the worlds of both finance and fiction.

Transcribed - Published: 25 March 2025

Mike Kelly joins me to explore Nassim Taleb’s book “Antifragile”, the central triad of fragility, robustness, and antifragility, the problems with separating “skin in the game” from risk, how Bitcoin embodies antifragility, the danger of centralized planning, the role of adversity in growth, and the importance of agency in a world where humans are programmable. Michael J Kelly III, is the producer of WiM and creative strategist with a passion for natural science and the intersection of politics and biology.

Transcribed - Published: 25 March 2025

George Bodine joins me to discuss the cost of working in law enforcement, the discipline needed to become a fighter pilot, the intersection of art and Bitcoin, the ramifications of fiat vs. sound money, the role of propaganda in the fiat system, Bitcoin as a digital organism, the oscillation between individualism and collectivism, and what it means to live with honor, strength, and integrity. George Bodine is a professional artist, ex-oil field worker, cab driver, miner, cop, and Navy fighter pilot.

Transcribed - Published: 18 March 2025

George Bodine joins me to discuss the cost of working in law enforcement, the discipline needed to become a fighter pilot, the intersection of art and Bitcoin, the ramifications of fiat vs. sound money, the role of propaganda in the fiat system, Bitcoin as a digital organism, the oscillation between individualism and collectivism, and what it means to live with honor, strength, and integrity. George Bodine is a professional artist, ex-oil field worker, cab driver, miner, cop, and Navy fighter pilot.

Transcribed - Published: 18 March 2025

Joe Bryan joins me to discuss his film “What’s the Problem”, the destructive cycle of Keynesian systems, the challenges of explaining Bitcoin to the layperson, how money printing enables theft to fund war, why all government spending is capital misallocation, and whether Bitcoin adoption is inevitable. Joe Bryan is an entrepreneur, investor, advisor, and creator of “What’s The Problem?”

Transcribed - Published: 14 March 2025

Noah Kaufman joins me to discuss the personality traits common among Bitcoiners, Bitcoin as a moral force for good, the intersection of human and monetary evolution, the impact of technology on self-actualization, the connection between the monetary and moral standard, the corruption of healthcare and money, the role of privacy in freedom, the end of the inflationary monetary system, and how Bitcoin aligns the incentives of the individual and the collective. Noah Kaufman is a Board certified ER doc with a series 65, a financial educator, public speaker, avid rock climber, and investor with extensive experience trading equities, options, and Bitcoin.

Transcribed - Published: 11 March 2025

Laryn Breedlove, Johann Urb, and Rachel Pringle join me to discuss conflict resolution through attachment theory, the importance of difficult conversations, the art of delivery in communication, managing anger with the sacred pause, the connection between sex and emotional intimacy, the difficulty of radical truth, and how practicing gratitude and embracing authenticity deepens intimacy and strengthens relationships. Johann Urb is the creator of the Pyramid Breath Method and The Art of Co-Devotional Love. Rachel Pringle, author of Wild Open and Dynamic Tantra Teacher, has 15+ years in human development and somatic healing, focusing on Tantric Embodiment, CoDevotional Communication, and Love in Partnership.

Transcribed - Published: 7 March 2025

Aaron Alexander joins me to discuss the connection between posture and mental health, the role of breathwork in emotional regulation, the benefits of grounding and stargazing, the intersection of ancient wisdom and modern science, the dangers of blue light, how to tap into a flow states, and how to optimize your health in the modern world. Aaron Alexander, CR, LMT, is a movement coach, host of the Align Podcast, and author of The Align Method: 5 Movement Principles for a Stronger Body, Sharper Mind, and Stress-Proof Life.

Transcribed - Published: 4 March 2025

Brian Dixon joins me to discuss his near-death experience, the philosophy of Bitcoin and its connection to spirituality, the mysteries of ancient Egypt and UFOs, the balance between free will and determinism, the effects of AI on communication, social engineering and depopulation theories, and how to optimize health, fitness, and nutrition in the modern world. Brian Dixon is an investor and the CEO of “Off The Chain Capital.”

Transcribed - Published: 28 February 2025

Tommy Aceto joins me to discuss making the unconscious conscious with psychedelics, the necessity of role models and storytelling, the journey of becoming a Navy Seal, the process of healing PTSD with psychedelic therapy, Bobby Kennedy and the politics of health, social media's affect on mental health, and how to fulfill our true potential in the modern world. Tommy Aceto is a former US Navy Seal and intelligence officer, father, breakthrough therapies advocate, writer and director, life coach and retreat coordinator, and veteran mental health chief officer at the Give to Give Foundation.

Transcribed - Published: 25 February 2025

Zuby joins me to discuss men competing in women’s sports, the importance of telling the truth (or at least not lying), the power that comes with fearing God above men, why people today are so soft, how money shapes the world, the future of social media, and how to have the adventure of your life. Zuby is an independent rapper, author, podcast host, public speaker and creative entrepreneur.

Transcribed - Published: 21 February 2025

Larry Lepard joins me to explore his new book “The Big Print”, what the next decade of money printing will look like, how inflation destroys the middle class, Metcalfe’s Law and the power of network effects, Bitcoin vs gold, the threat of paper bitcoin, the creation of a Strategic Bitcoin Reserve, and the hope of a hyperbitconized future. Lawrence W. Lepard is the founder and the Managing Partner of Equity Management Associates LLC and author of the new book “The Big Print”.

Transcribed - Published: 18 February 2025

Lucas and Grant of “Bitcoin Study Sessions” join me to explore the similarities between Bitcoin and black holes, why Bitcoin is digital 1776, the domestication of animals and humans, the magic of Bitcoin’s difficulty adjustment, the importance of path dependence, and how Bitcoin is a bidirectional portal linking the real and virtual worlds. Lucas and Grant of “Bitcoin Study Sessions” research and teach about canonical Bitcoin literature like Jason Lowery’s “SoftWar” and “Broken Money” by Lyn Alden.

Transcribed - Published: 14 February 2025

Lucas and Grant of “Bitcoin Study Sessions” join me to explore how humans project power through abstraction, how Bitcoin projects physical power, modern warfare and kinetic stalemate, proof-of-work and cybersecurity, Tesla and Ford’s prediction of eclectic money, and the tipping point for Bitcoin nation-state adoption.

Transcribed - Published: 11 February 2025