With conditions like depression and anxiety, it's not always a realistic option to obliterate the problem,

to find the cause of the suffering, and destroy the issue entirely, to be cured, to be healed,

and go back to normal, whatever normal is. Now, that doesn't always work. Sometimes you need to meet the problem, greet it,

learn to live with it. That can be a lot of work. It can also, sometimes, be the best path forward.

It's depression mode. I'm John Moe. I'm glad you're here. Hanif Abdur Rakib is an author, essayist, poet, thinker, cultural critic. He's received

really thunderous critical acclaim and numerous awards for his writing, including the MacArthur Fellowship,

often called the Genius Grant. His books include They Can't Kill Us Until They Kill Us,

A Little Devil in America, Notes in Praise of Black Performance, and There's Always This

Year on Basketball and Ascension, which is newly available in paperback. There's always this year

is part memoir, part exploration of basketball, part love letter to his hometown of Columbus, Ohio,

which he left and returned to. And it's about the significance of LeBron James, who also left

Ohio and returned. Hanif writes about challenges he's faced,

including incarceration and being unhoused. It's a beautifully written and remarkably moving book.

I've never read anything like it. Hanif also deals with clinical depression and anxiety disorders.

I had a wonderful conversation with him about basketball, about running,

about depression and anxiety, and about building and maintaining a network of support for when

things get bad.

Annie Fabdua Rakeeb, welcome to Depression Mode.

Yeah, thank you for having me.

Really appreciate being here.

I tried to describe your connection to LeBron and his role in your life to my wife when I was talking about doing this interview.

And I kind of fumbled on it.

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