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wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to the HBR Idea Cast from Harvard Business Review. I'm Sarah Green Carmichael. Today I'm

talking with David Burcas an associate professor of management at oral

Roberts University. He's a regular contributor to HBR.org and is the author of the new book Under New Management,

How Leading Organizations Are Upending Business as Usual.

He also has his own podcast called Radio Free Leener, so check that out as well.

David, thank you so much for talking with us.

Oh, Sarah, thank you so much for having me.

So one of the many provocative business trends that you cover in the book focuses on the

idea of salary transparency. So I wanted to

really focus on that today and ask you first just what's the basic gist here?

Does this mean that everyone knows how much money everyone else is earning?

So it can, and most often it does,

but what I think is most interesting is that the companies that are

experimenting with transparency do it all a little bit differently.

So the most famous examples are your companies

like Buffer or Some All or Whole Foods where everybody knows what everybody gets

paid, but then there are other companies that just say, okay, this is what this

...