For every 100 calories of protein that you eat, you only have, and people don't know this,

so for every 100 calories of protein you eat, you're only ever able to extract 70 calories of energy, 70.

So 30 calories for every 100 calories of protein you eat is used to process protein.

So protein calories are 30% wrong everywhere.

Well, that is the voice of Dr. Giles Yo, a geneticist at the University of Cambridge looking particularly at body weight,

and he thinks we need to stop counting calories.

Welcome to the Lizelle Wellbeing Show, I'm Lizelle, looking into ways to help us all have a better second half of life,

whatever our age or stage of life right now.

Well, as someone who's always been aware of what the scales register and how best to maintain a healthy weight for myself,

I am intrigued to hear the view that calories don't matter, and even that we shouldn't be counting them at all.

And I think this conversation is going to be especially useful and interesting, given the run-up to the festive season,

and the lure, perhaps, of one to many men's pies, yeah, guilty.

Well, I guess the thing is, we don't eat calories, do we eat food?

Or at least that is the mindset Dr. Giles Yo is keen for us all to have.

Many of us spend a lifetime counting calories, don't we?

But Giles' book is called Why Calories Don't Count, so what exactly is a calorie anyway?

And how can we stop being slaves to these little numbers?

Well, welcome back, Giles. It's been a while since we last spoke here.

Yeah, it's been since the before time, so, you know, BC pressure and privilege.

Thank you so much for having me on again.

Oh, no, it's a great pleasure. It was very, very popular last time,

and I think this is such a fascinating subject.

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