This is the reason interview with Nick Gillespie, where I go deep with the artists, entrepreneurs,

policymakers, and visionaries who are making the world a more libertarian, or at least a more

interesting place by challenging worn-out ideas and orthodoxies.

My guests today are filmmaker John Schenck and former Navy SEAL Marcus Capone.

Along with Bonnie Cohn, Shank is co-director of the new Netflix documentary in Waves and War,

which follows three former Navy SEALs as they use psychedelic-assisted therapy to deal with

post-traumatic stress disorder and traumatic brain injuries related to their service.

Capone is one of the three main

figures in the film. He first used the ultra-powerful substances, Ibugane and 5MEO DMT in 2017,

and he's the co-founder with his wife Amber of Vets, a nonprofit that helps veterans access

psychedelic therapies. He's also CEO of Tara Mind,

a company seeking to expand the use of psychedelic-assisted mental health therapies to all Americans.

I talk with them about why so many veterans and everyday people could benefit from psychedelic therapy

and the challenges of depicting both the grim

realities of war and the otherworldly experience of tripping on Ibu gain, which is called the

Mount Everest of Psychedelics. We also discussed why the Trump administration and an unlikely

bipartisan group of legislators may well help usher in what some are calling a psychedelic

renaissance. Here is the Reason interview with John Shank and Marcus Capone of In Waves and War.

John Shank, Marcus Capone, thanks for talking to Reason.

Great to be here. Thanks for having us.

Yeah.

This is a remarkable film that has two distinct halves to it, really, in a way.

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