Welcome to Our Head and House. This is Jasmine Singer. And this is Marianne Sullivan. And on this week's show, Marianne will be joined by Eva Haifa Jiro, who is a professor and the author of veganism, politics, practice, and theory,

which examines why veganism can be so controversial and argues that veganism has the potential

to act as, quote, more than a diet by disrupting assumptions about how humans relate to animals. Oh, I love that. I'm so excited

about listening to this. And I'm even more excited that you did this interview and not me, because she

sounds very smart. Yes, she's very smart. And she's thinking about all the important questions.

And she did a lot of interviews with longtime vegans and got their perspective and

she was vegan herself and I just love that there's like serious academic attention to

all of these issues not just to animals there should be more but not just to that but also to

how how to affect change and that's exactly what she's doing. I also wanted to make an

announcement before we get further into our chatting, because we have some special guests to chat with.

And I'll tell you about that in a second. But this is this program that I am moderating, and it's going to be

available on Zoom. I'm excited about it,

and is actually available for free. It's from the Women's Bar Association of the state of New York,

and they are providing CLE credit. If you want CLE credit, that's continuing legal education credit.

Then you would have to pay, but if you don't want that credit, you can attend for free.

And it's about the litigation about Happy the Elephant in the New York State Court of Appeals,

which is, of course, the highest court in the state of New York against the Bronx Zoo.

And it's also bringing in a speaker about litigation regarding the rights of natural entities,

such as lakes and rivers. So it's a really

interesting topic. And the title, which I did not come up with, is the best title in the history

of programs. It's the elephant in the zoo. That's easier to write than it is to say. The elephant

in the Zoom should non-humans and natural resources be considered

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