Hi, folks, this is Dan Allender. We have something very special in store for you this week. I'm delighted to step away from the microphone and share it with this conversation between Wendell Moss, who is a dear friend

and colleague at the Outlander's Center and Sam Eldridge, one of the brilliant young man

behind Anson's magazine in Colorado Springs, Colorado. Wendell and Sam talk about race, masculinity,

and trauma in a very vulnerable and thoughtful way.

We're so grateful to have N. Sons' podcast crew letting us share it with you now.

We've got something pretty great for you today, and I'll be honest, I am a little

trepidacious about it. I dropped a line to a friend and mentor of mine, Wendell Moss, who is a counselor

out in Seattle, and I asked them to come on our podcast and talk about trauma and masculinity and race.

Yeah.

That's right.

That's where we're going.

I know.

Just the light stuff.

You can feel you need to rotate your neck around, pop some joints.

This is a really good conversation that I've been excited to have,

and I think it's going to be well worth a listen. So thanks for stopping by today, and without

further ado. It's really good to see your face. You too, buddy. Wendell, normally, I kind of give

an outline, and then we actually edit that out of the podcast.

But there's part of me that wants to leave some of this in for the sake of our listeners.

I want to begin with this quote that I wrote down on my phone that a mutual friend and teacher,

Dan Allender once said that hearing someone else's story should be entered with the

kind of holiness that takes your shoes off. As we dive into this today, I want to say that

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