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Serving the best Americano in town is up to you. But winning back time and growing your business, leave that to sum up. Take orders and payments anywhere with the new sum up terminal. Turn occasional customers into regulars with a free loyalty program. And with the sumup point of sale system, you'll always know when you're running low on your best-selling blends. Visit sumup.co.uk to learn more. Hi, Bill Crystal here. Full work on Sunday. And I'm joined by Tom Jocelyn.

Again, about what, three, four months ago, we discussed the progress of Trump's authoritarian

project. And we were alarmed. And I guess we're a little more alarmed today.

By Tom, obviously, not obviously, but Tom has been a longtime friend,

contributed to the weekly standard, contributed to the bulwark,

the main author of the January 6th committee report in Congress.

And there's a close student of terrorism abroad,

and now what they're calling domestic terrorism at all, or the Trump's use of the term. Trump administration's used to the term domestic terrorism at home. So Tom, thanks for joining me today. Thanks for having me, Bill. You know, I just saw a video where JVL was talking with Sarah and JVL was very dispirited and saying we never would have gotten into this business if he knew it was going to end this way and this sort of authoritarian threat.

And I'll just say, you know, we deal with this every day. And I find it, you know, very discouraging that we are where we are. But I think we're going to get through this. And so chin up to JVL and everybody else, I would say. That's good. That's good. You're on the Sarah side of the big Sarah JVL. you know, psychological

split, which isn't really as big as they

pretend, but anyway,

so we'll talk about or JVL, you know, psychological split, which isn't really as big as they pretend. But anyway,

so we'll talk, we'll talk about what's, what's been happening, the whole use of the terrorism,

quote domestic terrorism, the attempt to assimilate the sort of the way we treat foreign terrorists

to stuff at home. Maybe we'll get to the Interaction Act as a possibility.

But let's begin with where I think you, in your writing and analysis of this, you've begun,

which is the mass deportation promise that Trump ran on and people kind of didn't take quite

as seriously as maybe they should have.

And I think you think, I don't want to put words in your mouth, you explain.

I think you think that's at the heart of what we're, or at least the trigger for what we're seeing. Yeah, I mean, I think we both do. I think the shortest path to an authoritarian regime is a mass deportation regime. And that's what they're pursuing. You know, there's a lot earlier this year. There were people that didn't think they would actually go through with it because they were kind of stalled out of the gate. But as we've seen now in the last couple months,

they've really accelerated matters. They really are going through with this idea that they're

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