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Welcome to political thinking, a political interview with a difference.

In this series, I have conversations with rather than interrogations of people who shape our political thinking, about what has shaped theirs.

Five years ago, I spoke to someone who was barely known outside

Westminster. He was seen as one to watch inside SW1. Wishi Sunnick had just made it into the cabinet,

and he spoke to me then about his pride in being a second-generation immigrant, about his upbringing, his values, his beliefs.

Little did we know, little did he know, that within weeks he'd be made Chancellor.

And alongside Boris Johnson confronts an unprecedented series of crises, the COVID health crisis,

the economic crisis which had helped to trigger,

and a rolling political crisis, which led to first Johnson and then his successor Liz Truss,

losing their jobs in just 50 days, catapulting Sunac into number 10.

My guess this week was the youngest prime minister in more than 200 years.

He is still the MP for Richmond and North Allerton in Yorkshire and eight months on from losing

the general election, he's now launching a foundation with his wife, Akshita. He's here to reflect

on the lessons he learned in Downing Street and an extended conversation.

Rishi Sudhan, welcome back to political thinking. Nick, nice to see you. Thanks for having me back.

After the election, you had some advice for new ministers in the new Labour government. You said in the comments and it raised a smile,

on the government bench's life, you said, comes at you fast.

Before you know, you've got a bright future behind you

and you're left wondering whether you can credibly be an elder statesman

at the age of 44.

Does that reflect how you feel that it's behind you? Well, I mean, look,

...