The Psychological Formula for Attraction ft. Jemma Sbeg

Soul Gum

by Victoria Hutchins

Philosophy, Society & Culture

4.9 • 561 Ratings

🗓️ 4 May 2025

⏱️ 49 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

What actually makes us feel drawn to someone—and what makes us cling to situationships long after we can see the glaring red flags of emotional unavailability?

In today's episode, I’m joined by my first-ever guest (!!) and one of my favorite podcasters of all time, Jemma Sbeg—host of the wildly popular Psychology of Your 20s podcast and the author of Person in Progress. If you’ve ever screamed-cried in your car after someone you weren’t even officially dating ghosted you, this one’s for you.

A few things we dive into:

A research-backed formula for attraction (and how to use it without playing games)
The role of the “spark” in attraction
The psychology behind common dating pitfalls in your 20s
The stigma of being single

The commitment-readiness scale (and why it can land you in situationship after situationship)

Jemma also shares insights from PERSON IN PROGRESS—a roadmap for surviving the chaotic, confusing, deeply transitional decade that is your twenties—and offers advice to her younger self that made me tear up a little. Whether you’re trying to understand your patterns, make sense of someone else's, or just feel a little less alone in the dating trenches, this one will stick with you.

EPISODE OUTLINE

00:00 Intro
02:51 The formula for attraction
04:21 1. Proximity
07:10 2. Similarity
11:43 3. Familiarity
14:03 The 3 month rule
16:55 The curse of comfort
19:31 The sunk cost fallacy
21:06 The fear of starting over
22:37 4. Reciprocity
23:13 The harm of playing games
26:36 5. A spark
27:19 The psychology of common relationship pitfalls
27:31 1. Repetition compulsion
31:04 2. The stigma of being single
36:45 3. Situationships
38:23 The commitment-readiness scale
40:21 Permission slip to grieve your situationship <3
42:09 Lightning round recap
43:26 Last question: what would you tell past you?

PERSON IN PROGRESS

If you liked this episode, you will love PERSON IN PROGRESS. Out now and available everywhere you buy books. Get your copy today!

PERSON IN PROGRESS BY JEMMA SBEG

MY LINKS

• ⁠MAKE BELIEVE is out everywhere now⁠

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠• ⁠Get a signed copy of MAKE BELIEVE from Blue Willow Bookshop⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠• ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Find me @thedailyvictorian on Instagram⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠• ⁠⁠Find me @thedailyvictorian on TikTok⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

PS - This is the study I mentioned that found that single women are one of the happiest demographics on Earth. And an article about it here!

Transcript

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0:00.0	A psychologically rooted formula for attraction?
0:04.5	Whoa.
0:05.7	Let's talk about it.
0:09.1	Sogum.
0:10.1	Welcome back to SoulGum, the self-development podcast with philosophical, psychological, and literary flair.
0:17.6	I'm your host, Victoria Hutchins.
0:19.5	My goal is to give your soul something to chew on. And today,
0:24.9	I have succeeded in that goal. Today is a very special episode because today we have a guest.
0:32.2	And not just any guest, one of my favorite podcasters of all time, Jim Aspeg, the host of the Psychology of
0:39.9	Your 20s podcast. I'm sure lots of y'all are listeners to Psychology of Your 20s. I am a long
0:46.3	time listener. I am so thrilled to have Jim on Soulgum. Psychology of your 20s is one of the
0:52.3	reason Soulgum exists. It is one of the
0:55.0	podcasts that got me so hooked on listening to podcasts that I started to think, hey, I might
0:58.7	like to have a podcast. And Jimma is no longer just a podcaster. She is a published author. Her debut
1:05.9	book, Person in Progress, is out now. It's a guide to navigating the personal and professional
1:10.6	transitions of
1:11.4	your 20s and it is full of advice that I wish I had in my 20s. It was so hard to decide what I wanted
1:18.8	to talk about with Gemma today because person in progress is truly loaded with practical
1:24.4	wisdom that I think you all would love and benefit from.
1:33.8	But today we are going to dive into some of the wisdom that person in progress offers on dating and relationships.
1:38.9	When I think about Victoria in her 20s, I see someone who was obsessed with relationships,
1:41.1	and I know I'm not alone there.
	...

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