Jeremy Carl is Senior Fellow at the Claremont Institute and former Deputy Assistant Secretary of the Interior,

and an expert on energy policy in the United States.

His new book addresses another subject.

It's called The Unprotected Class, How Anti-White Racism, is Tearing America Apart.

That's our topic today.

Welcome, Mr. Carl.

Thanks so much for having me, Mark.

We jump right in.

You begin with a particular problem in pointing out anti-white feelings at work in America,

which is that white elites, they often possess a noblesse oblige.

You actually use that term that disinclines them to acknowledge threats to their status or rights as whites as whites that they're certainly very protective of themselves but they don't want to do it

on the on any of that that that identity basis what is that about is that just the old white guilt at work or is there,

is there a new version of this going on? I think there's some of it. I mean, I think it's a really

complicated dynamic that you're seeing that involves a kind of a very much a moving target. So at a

certain point earlier on, and I kind of make the

sort of William F. Buckley analogy at one point, it's kind of, other groups are sort of so

marginal that there isn't any threat to your status by seemingly giving up a little bit, right?

Because you're still going to be ruling the roost more or less, you know, whether it's you or people like you. And then all of a sudden, as you have this big demographic change, that's no longer true. And by the way, you've already seated a bunch of power as it is. And now there's other groups that are kind of fighting for a place, and they have a lot of political power.

And they do not have the stigma against organizing that is attached to whites being organized in any way.

How many years going back, would you say, the particular phenomenon?

Yeah, I don't think there's there's kind of one point in time

you could give. I mean, I think, I mean, look, you wrote about this in a totally different,

...