Welcome to Episode 8 of the Olasky interview, brought to you by listener-supported World Radio.

I'm your host, Jill Nelson.

Today we'll listen in on Marvin's 2017 interview with author and social scientist Charles Murray.

Murray earned degrees from Harvard and MIT and has written numerous books,

among them, Losing Ground, published in 1984, and The Bell Curve. That one published a decade

later. Murray's writings have appeared in many major publications, and he's currently a fellow

with the American Enterprise Institute. That's a conservative think tank based in Washington, D.C.

Here now to preview this conversation is World Editor-in-Chief Marvin Olasky.

Hello, Marvin.

Hey, Jill.

Charles Murray has an extensive body of work he's built over several decades.

When did he first come on your radar and why?

Well, losing ground, his book in the 1980s was on my radar because a very wise book,

a very influential book, a very path-breaking book, looking at the question of how we deal

with the poor, how people who are poorer,

and how our society overall can gain ground rather than lose ground.

So a really good book.

And then in 1992, he wrote a forward to a book I wrote called The Tragedy of American Compassion

that looked at the history of poverty fighting in America,

and in some ways was going down the path that losing ground had plowed.

And then there were other books that came after that.

So we had some encounters of various times,

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