Hi and welcome to the working songwriter. The show where today's best songwriters come to talk shop. I'm your host Joe Pug.

Each episode here, we host a distinguished guest, and we ask them to go deep on their

inspiration, on their process, on the general ups and downs of making a life in music.

So, whether you're a grizzled veteran claiming to be the ghost writer of Vanilla Ice's entire debut album, or else a scrappy upstart, blowing your gig as a ghost writer by posting about it on Instagram, this is your show, because ultimately it is what every writer seeks most, an ironclad excuse to put off actually writing.

Hey, everybody, it's the fourth Friday of 2025, and I thank you for joining us. This week's show

was brought to you by bandzugal. Built by musicians and for musicians, Banzugal is an all-in-one

platform to build a beautiful website for your music. I'm old enough to remember when you had to pay

somebody called a web developer to get a website made.

It would always be some guy named Salvatore who drove a Dodge Viper with stolen Porelli tires

and who was always trying to sell you imported ginseng that he claimed was a male enhancement

stimulant.

An old Salvatore would charge you about a thousand bucks for a website that would be obsolete in six months.

But it's the future now, you guys, that's not how it works anymore.

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One of those nice things is Banzugal.

For over 20 years, Van Zougal has made it easy to build a stunning website

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Now they've added a brand new EPK plan

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Music players, images, text bio, video embeds, a gig calendar press quotes, and access to

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