Hello, everybody. Welcome to the Nuance Ho YouTube channel. Over here I have Bill Real and Bill's

doing a collab with me today on the Mormon Discussions YouTube channel, right? That's where you're

posting this. Yeah, I'm putting this on the Mormon Discussion YouTube channel. It's also streaming to my

Facebook page. Yay. Welcome both of our audiences today. Bill, you are just been such a wise thought leader in helping me deconstruct Mormonism from the very beginning.

And now the big topic that comes up a lot is what do I do with my spiritual experiences that I had within the church?

What does spirituality look like post the church?

For a long time, I would describe myself as an atheist.

I don't know about you, but that term for me just kind of means I don't worship one single

solitary God, but I do believe in different spiritual practices, mindfulness practices.

And I thought you've done a lot of good stuff in this space. And it's time

that we talk about them. And so thanks just for, thanks for coming on with me. I'm grateful for

the chance to sit down with you. I always find you informative and entertaining. And I appreciate

your voice in the space. And the fact that, you know, your journey,

uh, involved my work early on has me having a special allegiance to you and to your success.

So I'm, I'm excited to be part of this conversation. And I think this is an important conversation.

I'll, I'll just say on the front end, this is one of the topics I tend to stay away from.

I was telling you off the air that I've had what I would call incredible spiritual experiences.

At least that's how I defined them at some point along the way and haven't been able to

exactly call them something other, although their meaning may be different.

And I tend to not want to give

people who are deconstructing this part of the story, because when you hear someone who's

deconstructed Mormonism or any other religious system, tell you how marvelous their

...