This is CBS I in the world. I'm John Batchel.

Spending a wonderful conversation with Professor William Talbman, Bill Talbman of Amherst College.

He and his brother Philip Talbman have published a new book, McNamara at War,

which is a story of one man's rise through the world in the 20th century

that becomes a world of Cold War, of violence, of apocalyptic possibilities at any moment,

and mystery for a generation ours, the boomer generation, because that was the generation that was scarred by the Vietnam War, either there or here.

However, Robert McNamara is now in the war. He serves honorably statistical control. It's important to identify that in 21st century terms.

If I understand it, Bill, there was no sense in the military

before this to keep records of parts, supply chains, readiness, engines, morale, all of that

together. Is that correct? Yes, that was certainly true of the Army Air Corps,

whose commanding general, I think his name was Hap Arnold, wanted all of those things and set out to recruit people who would provide them, including McNamara.

The job was to keep the planes flying and to avoid the fact that they had an appalling destruction

a percentage.

What was it?

4%?

4% per flight.

I can think so, yes.

However, McNamara's job was to keep the planes flying and he was very good at it.

And he trained other people and he had partners through chiefly out of Britain because that's where the planes were launching from.

And that counting turned into an advantage everywhere.

The war is over and he's recruited by a man who sees that Ford Motor Company is falling well behind General Motors

because they don't know statistical control, nor do they pay attention to the fact that they're

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