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The John Batchelor Show

S8 Ep207: Turkel reveals he was born in a re-education camp during the Cultural Revolution, where his mother faced abuse for "guilt by association." He draws parallels between that era and today, explaining how intellectualism and foreign connections are still crim

The John Batchelor Show

John Batchelor

News, Arts, Books, Society & Culture

4.52.8K Ratings

🗓️ 18 December 2025

⏱️ 8 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

Turkel reveals he was born in a re-education camp during the Cultural Revolution, where his mother faced abuse for "guilt by association." He draws parallels between that era and today, explaining how intellectualism and foreign connections are still criminalized to justify the mass internment of Uyghurs.
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Transcript

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0:00.0

This is CBSI in the world.

0:07.0

I'm John Batchel with Nuri Turkle, the author of No Escape,

0:10.0

the new book is The True Story of China's Genocide of the Uyghurs.

0:13.9

Nouri was born in a prison camp, his mother, Aisha.

0:18.5

Why was she in prison?

0:20.0

Why was she being abused by the guards, Nore?

0:22.7

Simply put, guilt by association. My mother is a remarkable woman. And anyone can say things

0:34.5

like that about their mother, and they should. But my mother was remarkable in

0:39.2

many aspects. One, she was very aware of the political environment early on, supporting my

0:47.0

maternal grandfather who was politically very active and involved in the second East Turkestan

0:53.0

Republic.

1:00.6

That's what that was established in 1944 and dismantled by Mao's China with the help of Stalin's Soviet Union.

1:02.6

That national sentiment longing for independent state was part of the Uyghur people and the

1:09.1

society.

1:09.7

My grandfather was very influential a businessman.

1:12.8

He had a jewelry store, and he was a musician,

1:18.3

and he had family and friends.

1:20.3

I gathered at my maternal grandparents' house,

1:23.5

and my mom was a cheap host, opening the door, greeting and sending them out. So the Chinese

1:29.2

noted that my mom had a very special connection to this nationalist individual who was my

1:35.6

grandfather. And the start of the cultural revolution, the Red Guards rounded up, Uyghurs

1:42.9

much like the way that started

...

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