This is Karen Hunter and welcome to the hub. Part 2 of my conversation with Robin De Angelo is up next.

She's an amazing social scientist and one of the most clear thinking people on the issue of race.

She catches a lot of blows from white folk because they feel

that she's a betrayer. But I believe that if you really want this country to be strong and

if you want America to be great, you have to participate in making sure that there's equality and justice for all because those are the founding principles

We can talk about the BS all we want but America will never be truly great until there are opportunities for everyone who is here to compete on an equal playing field.

Up next, part two of my interview with Robin De Angelo, author of White Fragility, why it's so hard

for white people to talk about racism.

So I work in corporate America, where I happen to be one of only,

I'm the only one, the only black woman, the only person of color who holds a title in my firm. And one of the initiatives

that I've attempted to advance ad nauseum is diversity and inclusion initiatives. Because I feel as if the way in which they approach talent hiring

I could present I've presented business cases on why it makes sense to do business in communities of color

when you look at who's going into business for themselves, who's becoming entrepreneurs,

we know that that group is black women, right?

But I can walk into a room and have a conversation with a new black business

owner in a way in which most white people cannot, right? And so when we talk about

ways in which we want to grow as an organization, right, it makes sense for us to talk about when we talk about

organic growth it makes sense for us to talk about having people who look like

the world that we inhabit, right, to go out and talk to people who also inhabit

this world and do business. But for some reason

every time I bring that conversation up I am met with immediate resistance and

one of the discussions that I had in HR surrounded around the ageism that there were seven decades

...