This is John Bachelor, conversation with my colleague Josh Roggen of the Washington Post about three American citizens.

Wrongly detained is the terminology used by the State Department by the People's Republic of China.

Kiley, Mark Swindon, and David Lynn held for charges that do not bear scrutiny.

One supposedly a drug trafficker, a businessman in China

held for 12 years.

Another accused of making contact with Christianity.

Another accused of, well, he was in Shanghai to bury his mother.

These are abused people.

Swinnen has been incarcerated since 2012.

And Nicholas Burns, the U.S. ambassadors in contact with the Chinese authorities.

And Josh Rogan writes his column to say everybody's doing the right thing, time is running

out for the Biden people. Why are they still held? Pointing to the example of the

trade with Russia. Josh Roggan, Washington Post, about three detained Americans by the People's Republic of China,

our adversary.

More of this tonight.

Yeah, I mean, basically, I think if you had to analyze the Chinese government's perspective is that they want something, you know, but they have nothing to gain from letting him go for free and from their perspective that's in their interest so they might as well keep him.

And that's the kind of punitive cold system that the Chinese Communist Party is instituted there.

There's no, you know, humanitarian consideration. There's no, you know, humanitarian consideration.

There's no diplomatic consideration other than what they can trade him for.

And all I argue for in the column is that, okay, let's get these guys

bumped up to the top of their priority list because who knows what's going to happen

after President Biden leaves office and no matter who's the next president they have to

...