But I guess when I think about it, like any, any decade is going to, like any period of a decade

plus is going to seem like a big change no matter what.

If you look at, you know, I can vaguely remember 1990.

I can also remember 11 years ago.

It doesn't seem that different.

But there's a huge difference between, you know, 1979 and 1990 in America.

But there's an even bigger difference, it seems, between 1970 and 1990 and

Britain. And I'm wondering, like, what do you see that legacy as being? Because it does really

feel to me like everything about the sort of modern state that we live in, the condition we

live in here comes from that. And it's great. It's awesome. We love it. No complaints.

Yeah, well, I've been privileged to have a kind of box seat, really, because I worked for a series of councils in the in the 90s and 2000s and housing associations.

And I've also taught in the post-war settlement and Thatcherism.

And when you were teaching that kind of course, 20th century British politics or 20th century British history,

the division was almost always made between 1945 to 1979 and 1979 to the present.

So, you know, the Atenham reforms and the Thetri reforms both shaped the country for decades to come, really.

And if you'd ask me before 2008, what her legacy was, I would have said she'd changed the country forever.

To be frank, I'm still not sure she hasn't, but at least you've got some sense of resistance after 2008.

When she said her, you know, her aim was to change people's souls, I think she succeeded.

I mean, her strategy was always dividing rule, obviously.

She picked off a lot of working class votes.

She gave working class people the means to become lower middle class through the sale of council houses for example and through the sale of

national assets by attacking the public sector relentlessly she paved the way

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