Hey, this is the moment. I'm Brian Koppelman. Thanks for listening. My guest today is a

legendary figure in the worlds of politics and communications.

Jennifer Palmieri, whose new book she proclaims

is a great read.

I broke the chain of people who haven't read it

because it was recommended by a bunch of people who,

Jennifer and I both knew, probably hadn't read the book, but it's incredibly well written.

I can see the way people are reacting to it.

I love the stuff you've written, excerpts from it and the stuff you've written from it also

Before that you were

worked in the Obama administration Clinton administration right and and also you were Com's director and Com's director on Hillary's campaign.

And Jennifer, I, I read in my doing my research,

I read the most dispiriting interview with you.

Oh no. Well, because it was from this moment in 2016 and it was just it

was just after the it was just after the conventions and you were being asked about the lead that you had and you talked about the can and it's like

I'm reading Nate Silver today. It's just like all the exact same stuff and I just want to start

before we get into your book which is about how to reframe women in the workplace, women in America, and sort of a new declaration of how women should function and how we should think about women in the workforce.

But before that, because you have lived through this, I have to start with where do you find

hope for the country, for the world, for our prospects going forward?

Because I know that there are more people in America that want America to be more just to think it's capable of being

more just than there are not.

It doesn't mean that our democratic systems aren't in desperate need of repair it doesn't mean

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