Hello Hello Hello. I am particularly delighted today to be joined by the brilliant Daniel Levy who is the he's got so many hats that I'm just going to just throw a few hats of his head. He's for example former he was on the negotiating team when Ehad Barak was Prime Minister of Israel

he has been involved in many think tanks specializing of course in the Middle East.

He's a commentator, he's an analyst, many, many hats Daniel.

How are you? Hello.

Overwhelmed with hats, Owen. How are you?

I'm all good. You're juggling them very well.

So, we're now 11 weeks into this horror.

I always struggle to find the exact proper terms to describe what this is. I think horror will do for now.

I just want to start actually, just because you know you were under Arab-Arher Barak and also a junior member under Yitzak Rabin, who was obviously Prime Minister of Israel back in the 1990s before his assassination.

And it's just recently we've had these comments by Zippy Ottavelli, who is the Israeli ambassador to the UK,

in which she said that there was no chance of any future Palestinian state.

And then Mark Regev, the former ambassador, who was a spokesperson for the Israeli government, said that actually the never that under even under Yitzak Rebin, he was the Prime Minister, who was associated with the Oslo records and being a peacemaker, the Palestinians were promised an entity less than a state.

So I'm just interesting in that because there's a narrative of the Palestinians always had these opportunities to have a state,

they didn't accept them and they brought this on themselves basically.

What do you think about that whole narrative and what the comments of Mark Regev and of Zippy Hottervelli.

Yeah I think there's some really important stuff to unpack there.

Let me relate to what Mark Regev said and Rubbin's position and we can't know right you can't do the

counterfactual he gets assassinated in November of 1995 by a religious Jewish extremist.

I actually think most Palestinians who look at the history of this would sign up to what Mark

reg have said unusually and say yeah that's exactly the point we have never

this idea that the Palestinians have consistently missed opportunities, been rejectionist. Well, we've never been offered a sovereign state. Thank you for clarifying that Mr. Rebbin was perhaps on a journey and things

that he said would be red lines before he came into office in 92 once he was in office began to

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