I mean, not only was the war well underway, but ISIS was well underway.

And they were sort of stunning the world with their brutality.

And, you know, they were just, not that they killed more people than anyone else, but they

did it more publicly, more sadistically.

And that, Nick and I felt like that needed some explaining.

Like, what is that?

Hi, and welcome back to the Modern War Institute podcast.

I'm John Amble, editorial director at MWI.

And this episode of the podcast features a conversation we're thrilled to

bring to our listeners. Captain Jake Morali speaks to Sebastian Younger, a journalist, writer,

and filmmaker whose work in recent years has helped readers and viewers to really understand

wars and those who fight them. His latest project is called Hell on Earth, the Fall of Syria

and the Rise of Isis.

In the film, Younger and his colleague Nick Quested take that same approach to capture what

it's like for those who lived through the Islamic State's brutal takeover of vast stretches

of territory in Iraq and Syria.

The result is a story of war that is intense, emotional, at times uncomfortable, and very real.

In the conversation, Younger explains why he decided to tackle this particular project after

a series of books and films that focused on America's post-9-11 wars and the men and women who have fought them.

He also discusses the impact the film had on him and what he learned from making

it.

Before we get to the conversation, just a couple quick notes.

...