The fire community has this backwards.

We're optimizing for financial independence like it's going to solve all of our problems.

But what if reaching fire doesn't actually make you happier?

Hello, hello, hello, hello, and welcome to the Bigger Pockets Money podcast.

My name is Mindy Jensen.

And with me, as always, is my happy and he knows it co-host, Scott Trench.

Hooray! We are so excited to be joined today by Paul Ollinger. Paul was one of Facebook's first 250 employees. He retired at the age of 42 and has gone on to start his own podcast, reasonably happy. And he's also got a successful stand-up comedy career.

We are excited to talk about his relationship with money, happiness, and the aspects of

the fire movement that absolutely terrify him.

Paul, welcome to bigger pockets money.

Thank you, Scott.

Thank you, Mindy.

Well, Paul, let's jump into it because we are a fire podcast talking to and about the fire

community. What do you think about the fire community and the fire movement? I love the phi. I'm not so

crazy about the er part of it or the re part of it because I think financial independence, the

importance of financial independence

in America, especially today, cannot be overstated.

And my wish for everyone is to achieve financial autonomy, that we mistakenly focus on wealth

as the desired outcome as opposed to self-determination.

And financial independence is something that has given me a great deal of joy in my life.

And as I say to people, I was very fortunate to work in the right industry at the right time.

I worked real hard and I made a lot of money.

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