Hello, I'm Hugo Rifkin, and now we're going to be unpacking the politics of the day,

from what Kirste Starma can do to avoid a trade war with the US to the latest defections to reform,

and whether politicians from different parties should still chat to each other in TV green rooms.

And joining me are two people who sit in stony silence until the moment we go on air,

and they are Charlotte Ivers.

Hello, Charlotte.

Hello, Hugo.

Well, obviously I hate Seb in public, so it would be very traitorous of me not to be incredibly root to him in private, too. And they're hated by Charlotte, Seb Payne. I'm just sitting crying in the corner here. I'm trying to think if you are even political opponents,

so you ought to get on anyway, really.

We can spend the next 45 minutes debating that.

I think so, really.

We've spent the next 45 minutes debating that. I think so, yeah, it's a point of much contention. I think there'll be like there's probably like a Venn diagram of things, of which is probably fair bit of overlap. Everything I'm right on, Seb is also right on. Everything Seb is wrong on nothing to do with me. Well, we'd like to think

that the stony silence happens on this show after the discussion rather than before it. So let's see

how we get on. The Prime Minister this morning has said that Donald Trump is completely wrong

to threaten to put tariffs on countries that oppose his plan to take over Greenland.

Here he is speaking at a press conference in Downing Street a little earlier. The use of tariffs

against allies is completely wrong.

It is not the right way to resolve differences within an alliance.

Nor is it helpful to frame efforts to strengthen Greenland security

as a justification for economic pressure.

But there was also a lot of the Starmid didn't say he appealed to rule out retaliatory tariffs against the US,

and when asked if the King's visit to America later this year would be cancelled,

...