BITCOIN SEASON 2: Why tokens don't work (except for Bitcoin)
CoinDesk Podcast Network
CoinDesk
4.8 • 689 Ratings
🗓️ 9 July 2025
⏱️ 60 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
Gwart discusses the death of the fat protocol thesis, why DAOs became dysfunctional, and crypto's shift from public goods delusion to revenue-focused businesses. Plus thoughts on Bitcoin maximalism and Solana's pragmatic approach.
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Gwart joins us to talk about the collapse of crypto's "public goods" era and why the revenue meta is taking over. We dive deep into the fat protocol thesis, why DAOs failed, the difference between Bitcoin and crypto, and how builders are finally focusing on sustainable businesses instead of token hacking.
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**NOTES:**
• Pump.fun crossed hundreds of millions in revenue
• Fat protocol thesis originated 2016-2017
• iPhone example: $1,000 vs theoretical $10,000
• Uniswap has fee switch but hasn't turned it on
• Thread guy has 5% Bitcoin portfolio allocation
• Bitcoin could 10x in next five years
Timestamps:
00:00 Start
01:59 Bitcoin vs Crypto
06:08 What does Gwart "believe" in?
08:33 Revenue Meta & Fat Protocol Thesis
13:36 Interpreting the Fat Protocol Thesis
19:25 Analogies to Linux, etc
27:18 Is the DAO dead?
31:27 Devs
37:35 Creators of the Revenue delusion
40:46 Are stonks the new tokens?
45:01 Solana maxi
50:22 Real World Assets ;P
53:10 Minting new BTC maxis
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Transcript
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| 0:57.0 | Hey everyone, Colin here. |
| 1:00.8 | We're running a short survey to get better information on who listens to the show. |
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| 1:15.2 | You can find a link to the survey and the show notes. |
| 1:16.0 | Thanks. |
| 1:18.0 | Welcome back to Bitcoin Season 2. |
| 1:19.9 | This is the crossover episode. |
| 1:21.0 | You've all been waiting for. |
| 1:23.8 | I have Blockspace Media Extended Universe character, |
| 1:27.1 | Wardy Gwart on the show. |
| 1:30.3 | You probably know him for banger tweets such as, quote, it's incredibly embarrassing that Satoshi did not think of yield. Gward is a provocateur, |
... |
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