I'm John Batchel with my colleague Judy Dempsey of the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace.

She's a senior scholar. She's in Berlin. She's helped me understand the EU, which is the trade engine of Europe.

But there is NATO, and it's not exactly the same. It's a little larger.

And it has a different mandate, which is defense on the basis of the threat of the Russian Federation.

That describes Ukraine.

However, it also describes the whole of Black Sea Basin, because Judy's led me to understand that George is in turmoil.

It just had a vote.

There's some sharp words.

And Moldova, although it had a vote sustaining the

present government, it is in turmoil as well. There are all kinds of rumors going about in the

Black Sea Basin. And then there's Ukraine. So I don't isolate Ukraine. The whole of the Black Sea

Basin can be at risk. Turkey is also an unknown

as we go forward. Judy, how does Europe think about the war and the potential of more disorder

in the Black Sea Basin? And does Trump make a difference?

The Europeans as a whole, as the EU don't think of the Black Sea Basin collectively

at all, the countries that do think of the Black Sea Basin, and this is a very special area

for Turkish influence, for Russian influence, and for American influence.

The Europeans don't have a coherent policy on this.

Romania does, member of the EU and NATO.

So does Bulgaria, member of the EU and NATO.

So this Turkey, member of NATO, but not of the EU.

So these three countries who have close ties with Moldova and Georgia and Ukraine, they are worried about

...