In the consult, we discuss cases involving violence, sexual violence, abduction, and murder.

Sometimes the cases we discuss involve children.

Listener discretion is advised. Welcome to the consult. I'm Julia Cowley, retired FBI agent and profiler.

And today I'm joined by two remarkable guests, Heidi Miller, co-founder of the Sherry Black Foundation and Aaron Ryan, the Foundation's executive director.

If you've been following the show, you know I recently covered the murder of Sherry Black with Col case detective Ben Pender of the Salt Lake County Sheriff's Department.

Before we dive into our conversation, I'll share a little background on Heidi and Aaron, and then we'll discuss the important work of the Sherry Black Foundation and its impact on advancing criminal investigations. So Heidi Miller's advocacy

for victims of violent crime began after the murder of her mother in 2010. During the 10 years it

took to solve Sherry's case, Heidi learned about the gaps in our justice system and the resources

needed to help advance homicide investigations.

In 2014, she helped the nonprofit DNA saves approach the state of Utah to pass legislation

that allows for obtaining DNA samples from all persons arrested for felonies.

In 2017, she co-founded the Sherry Black Foundation with her husband,

Greg, to share the knowledge they gained on their journey for justice. Heidi is a champion

for investigative genetic genealogy, or IgG. She worked tirelessly to pass Sherry's law in Utah

in 2023, securing it as a tool for solving violent crime cases.

She has used her platform to encourage members of the public to become genetic witnesses by uploading their DNA to approve databases and opting in to help professional genetic genealogists build family trees to

generate leads for law enforcement. While Heidi is very proud of the dozens of unsolved cases

the foundation has helped to solve and the thousands of law enforcement agents trained in advanced

investigative techniques, she is also proud of her family.

She and Greg have six children and over 15 grandchildren.

Erin Ryan has been with the Sherry Black Foundation since its inception in 2017, helping to create partnerships and provide training opportunities for law enforcement.

Erin's experience crosses many types of violent crime. She started her career in Colorado,

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