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The John Batchelor Show

6/8: Plato and the Tyrant: The Fall of Greece's Greatest Dynasty and the Making of a Philosophic by James Romm (Author)

The John Batchelor Show

John Batchelor

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4.5 • 2.8K Ratings

🗓️ 4 July 2025

⏱️ 6 minutes

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Summary

6/8: Plato and the Tyrant: The Fall of Greece's Greatest Dynasty and the Making of a Philosophic by James Romm (Author)

1869 PLATO'S ACADEMY

https://www.amazon.com/Plato-Tyrant-Greatest-Philosophic-Masterpiece/dp/1324093188/ref=tmm_hrd_swatch_0

Plato is one of history's most influential thinkers, the "sublime philosopher" whose writings remain foundational to Western culture. He is known for the brilliant dialogues in which he depicted his teacher, Socrates, discussing ethical truths with prominent citizens of Athens. Yet the image we have of Plato—an ethereal figure far removed from society and politics, who conjured abstract ideas in peaceful groves—is a fiction, created by Plato's admirers and built up over centuries. In fact, Plato was very much a man of the world.

In Plato and the Tyrant, acclaimed historian and classicist James Romm draws on personal letters of Plato—documents that have long been kept in obscurity—to show how a philosopher helped topple the leading Greek power of the era: the opulent city of Syracuse. There, Plato encountered two authoritarian rulers, a father and son both named Dionysius, and tried to steer them toward philosophy. At the same time, he worked on his masterpiece, Republic, in which he conceived a ruler who unites perfect wisdom with absolute power. That dream has echoed down through the ages and given rise to a famous term, one that Plato himself didn't actually use: philosopher-king.

As Romm reveals, Plato's time in Syracuse helped shape Republic—and also had disastrous results for Plato himself and for all of Greek Sicily. The younger Dionysius, emotionally unstable but intellectually curious, welcomed Plato with open arms, but soon the relationship soured. Plato's close friendship with Dionysius's uncle, Dion—possibly a bond of romantic love—created a rift in the ruling family that led to a chaotic civil war.

Combining thrilling political drama with explorations of Plato's most cherished ideas, Romm takes us into the heart of Greece's late classical age, a time when many believed that democracy had failed. Plato's search for solutions led him to write his fervent plea for a new political order, and also led him to a place where he believed his theories might be put into practice. But Plato and the Tyrant demonstrates how Plato's experiment with enlightened autocracy spiraled into catastrophe, and also gives us nothing less than a new account of the origins of Western political thought.

Transcript

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0:00.0

I'm John. That's with Professor James Rob, and the book is unpredictable because it's not Shakespeare.

0:09.9

It doesn't give us a proverb at the end to feel good about.

0:13.4

Or even King Kong, Beauty Killed the Beast.

0:16.2

We now follow, remember the teenager who drank too much and caused his uncle, brother-in-law,

0:22.9

much distress that led to the invasion fleet that is now pulled apart Syracuse, is no longer

0:29.8

the most powerful state, which must have made them smile in Rome and Carthage and Athens.

0:35.0

Must have. I get suspicious sometimes.

0:38.4

However, Dionysius' second is still on the scene or has returned from the mainland.

0:44.9

And he's in the island.

0:48.6

Is that correct, Professor?

0:49.7

He and his men are secure in the island.

0:53.1

That's right.

0:54.4

Until from Corinth, which is the mother city of Syracuse, several hundred years before,

1:01.5

a man named Tomolian.

1:02.8

Who is he?

1:05.1

DeMoleon was a mature man, a man in his 50s who had lived a private life in Corinth for decades after a political episode that had badly tarnished him and forced him out of politics.

1:22.6

But when the call came from Syracuse to help us here, we need some kind of leadership.

1:30.7

Tumoleon was appointed to lead a hired army to try to take control of the situation.

1:38.1

And Corinth wanted this to happen?

1:41.2

Well, they wanted to make some kind of effort.

1:43.3

Syracuse, as you said earlier, it was originally their colony. So as the mother city, they felt an obligation to at least try to get things back on track. And Timoian was their token effort to do that. I got the impression from the way you tell the story. He wasn't well financed and he just

2:02.1

had a bunch of volunteers all in it for the plunder. Is that the way to think of it?

...

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