#462 – Ezra Klein and Derek Thompson: Politics, Trump, AOC, Elon & DOGE

Lex Fridman Podcast

Lex Fridman

Philosophy, Society & Culture, Science, Technology

4.7 • 13K Ratings

🗓️ 26 March 2025

⏱️ 199 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

Ezra Klein is one of the most influential voices representing the left-wing of American politics. He is a columnist for the NY Times and host of The Ezra Klein Show. Derek Thompson is a writer at The Atlantic and host of the Plain English podcast. Together they have written a new book titled Abundance that lays out a set of ideas for the future of the Democratic party.
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Transcript:
https://lexfridman.com/ezra-klein-and-derek-thompson-transcript

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EPISODE LINKS:
Abundance (new book): https://amzn.to/4iZ1S8J
Ezra's X: https://x.com/ezraklein/
Ezra's Instagram: https://instagram.com/ezraklein
Ezra's YouTube: https://youtube.com/EzraKleinShow
The New York Times: https://nytimes.com/by/ezra-klein
Derek's X: https://x.com/dkthomp
Plain English (podcast): https://www.theringer.com/podcasts/plain-english-with-derek-thompson
The Atlantic: https://theatlantic.com/author/derek-thompson/

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OUTLINE:
(00:00) - Introduction
(03:17) - Sponsors, Comments, and Reflections
(10:33) - Left-wing vs right-wing politics
(19:54) - Political leaders on the left and the right
(44:29) - Internal political divisions
(47:29) - AOC
(58:50) - Political realignment
(1:10:32) - Supply-side progressivism
(1:17:42) - Wealth redistribution
(1:27:50) - Housing problem
(1:44:09) - Regulation and deregulation
(2:00:43) - DOGE, Elon, and Trump
(2:59:46) - Sam Harris
(3:09:24) - Future of America

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Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0	The following is a conversation with Ezra Klein and Derek Thompson.
0:05.1	Ezra is one of the most influential voices representing the left wing of American politics.
0:10.2	He is a columnist for the New York Times, author of Why We're Polarized, and host of the Ezra Klein Show.
0:19.5	Derek is a writer at the Atlantic, author of hitmakers and on
0:24.5	work, and host of the plain English podcast. Together, they've written a new book, simply titled
0:31.8	Abundance, that lays out a kind of manifesto for the left. It is already a controversial, widely debated book,
0:40.2	but I think it puts forward a powerful vision for what the Democratic Party could stand for
0:45.1	in the coming election. If I may, let me comment on the fact that sometimes on this podcast
0:51.8	I delve into the dark realm of politics.
0:55.2	Indeed, politics often devises, and frankly brings out the worst in some very smart people.
1:02.2	Plus, to me, it is frustrating how much of the political discourse is drama, and how little of it
1:08.2	is rigorous empathetic discussion of policy. I hate this, but I guess I
1:14.3	understand why. If the other side is called either Hitler or Stalin online by swarms of chanting
1:20.3	mobs, it's hard to carry out a nuanced discussion about immigration, healthcare, housing, education,
1:27.4	foreign policy, and so on.
1:29.8	On top of that, anytime I talk about politics, half the audience is pissed off at me.
1:35.4	And no, there is no audience capture. I get shit on equally by different groups across the
1:41.2	political spectrum depending on the guests.
1:48.7	Why, I don't know, but I'm slowly coming to accept that this is the way of the world.
1:56.0	I try to maintain my cool, return hate with compassion, and learn from the criticism and the general madness of it all.
1:58.9	Still, I think it's valuable to sometimes talk about politics. It's an important
2:03.4	part to the big picture of human civilization, but indeed, it is only still a small part. My happy place
	...

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