451. Growth Secrets From the Best of the Best

The Game Changing Attorney Podcast with Michael Mogill

Michael Mogill

Marketing, Entrepreneurship, Business, Management

5.0 • 539 Ratings

🗓️ 7 April 2026

⏱️ 101 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

What separates the firms that scale from the ones that stay stuck? In this special mashup episode of The Game Changing Attorney Podcast, Michael Mogill sits down with the four Firm of the Year winners from the 2025 Game Changers Summit. Laura dePaz Cabrera of dePaz Cabrera Immigration Law, Koro Khamo of Khamo Law, John Richmond of Richmond Vona, and David Meyer of Meyer Wilson Werning each share what it really takes to build a firm that grows without burning you out in the process. From learning to let go of control to betting the farm on the right technology, this episode reveals the mindset shifts and strategic decisions that turned their practices into powerhouses. Here's what you'll learn: Why staying small is often the riskiest decision you can make, and how scaling protects your future How to build systems that run without you, so your firm can thrive even when you're not in the room Why culture is non-negotiable at every stage If you want to build a firm that scales, this episode will show you what some of the best in the business actually did to get there. ---- Show Notes: 5:14 — Laura DePaz Cabrera on building a human-centered immigration practice 16:08 — Why the outcome must always be tempered by the human impact 19:01 — Laura describes the culture of relentless pursuit of excellence 27:35 — Koro Khamo on scaling from startup to Premier Firm of the Year 40:26 — How Koro uses 11-year forecasting and AI to drive growth 44:29 — Why staying in place means falling behind in today's market 49:42 — The overpaid employee trap: why solos need to think bigger 54:09 — John Richmond on scaling from two people to 50+ in six years 1:06:24 — How leadership evolves as you scale from six to eight figures 1:07:41 — Defending culture at all costs, even when it means losing high performers 1:14:49 — Richmond Vona's approach to AI integration and change management 1:16:22 — David Meyer on transforming from chaos to intentional growth 1:24:25 — The catalyst that shifted Meyer Wilson from technical mastery to business excellence 1:32:25 — How David learned to let go and trust his leadership team 1:36:50 — Training for an Ironman as proof of a self-managing firm ---- Links & Resources: dePaz Cabrera Immigration Law Khamo Law Richmond Vona Meyer Wilson Werning Alexander Shunnarah Rocket Fuel by Gino Wickman ---- Do you love this podcast and want to see more game changing content? Subscribe to our YouTube channel. ---- Past guests on The Game Changing Attorney Podcast include David Goggins, John Morgan, Alex Hormozi, Randi McGinn, Kim Scott, Chris Voss, Kevin O’Leary, Laura Wasser, John Maxwell, Mark Lanier, Robert Greene, and many more. ---- If you enjoyed this episode, you may also like: 410. The Firm of the Future Won't Wait for You to Catch Up 376. Best of AMMA — Brand-Building Secrets Your Competitors Will Hate You For 308. AMMA — Overcoming Doubt: Turning Fear into Fuel

Transcript

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0:00.0	As a business owner, you have to focus on outcomes.
0:05.1	At the end of the day, that is the determining factor.
0:08.0	But to me, the outcome always has to be tempered by the human impact in achieving that outcome.
0:16.0	Welcome to a special edition episode of the Game Changing Attorney podcast featuring the firm of the year award winners announced at the 2025 Crisp Game Changers Summit.
0:24.1	When you have cases, do you have revenue and you're making money, it takes a certain kind of person to say, look, I'm glad things are going well, but how can we really make this better to scale and from efficiency and operations and leadership?
0:36.9	I didn't do that until really, you know,
0:39.4	seven, eight years ago.
0:47.3	I'm Michael Mogul, founder and CEO of Crisp, the nation's number one law from growth company.
0:52.1	I've built my business through practice, not theory. Crisp started with just $500 to my name and has grown to over eight figures in
0:58.6	revenue over the last few years, earning a spot on the Inc. 500 list of the fastest growing
1:03.0	private companies in America. Our approach has been to take everything we've learned about
1:06.8	generating massive growth within our own organization and help the country's most ambitious and committed law firm owners do the same for theirs. In each episode of this podcast,
1:14.8	I sit down with innovative market leaders from the legal industry and beyond to learn from those
1:19.6	who thrive in the face of adversity, challenge the status quo, and define what it means to be a true
1:24.5	game changer. Today, we're sharing my conversations with Laura from DePaz Cabrera Immigration Law,
1:30.3	Koro from Kamo Law, John from Richmond Vona, and David from Meyer Wilson Werning.
1:35.3	When you're small, when your revenue is less than a million dollars,
1:39.3	when your revenue is between $1 to $10 million. You never have the mentality
1:44.7	that you can become that $100 million
1:46.6	plus revenue firm.
1:48.9	And that's really achievable.
1:50.6	But you just have to trust yourself.
	...

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