Hello and welcome to Outrage and optimism. My name is Tom Riveik Karnak.

And I am still Christiano Figuetus this time we're both talking to you from Costa Rica.

And we have no Paul Dickinson.

Sadly, we miss him.

That's because he didn't want to come to Costa Rica.

That's his own fault.

Yeah, you know why that is.

Why?

He's terrified of the insects.

I know.

He is terrified of little bugs and spiders and

butterflies and things like that. I actually think lobsters this is primary fear.

Well that's true too. But we don't have too many of those up here on the mountain. Anyway, it's nice to be here in Costa Rica, the country that your father created.

Well, that, yeah, I'm not sure that he physically created, but let's say,

ideologically, he did guide this country.

Well, you know, I have, I was very lucky to just go and spend the last two weeks down on the

Caribbean coast here in Costa Rica.

And sitting on the beach I would look north and south along the coast and it looked like an untamed

wilderness and it was just looked like forest as far as the eyes can see and I said

what's behind that forest.

Well and then tucked into the forest is beautiful little bamboo created huts and things like that.

But I said a thank you to your father who created the law that meant that you can't build along the beach and I

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