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I saw the making of Thriller just instantly became obsessed. I wanted to be just like, and I dress like him every day and did my hair and had my hair permed to look like him and all that stuff.

The layers of choice to protect are very deep with victims. There's a self-protection of shame and blame. They may feel responsible or culpable for the abuse, especially if the offender grooms them was saying, you know, this is our secret, we'll go to jail.

You said it's harder for boys in particular, too.

Well, especially back when Michael Jackson was being accused of homosexuality was more shameful.

And so there's things that go with boys, including they're not socialized to talk about vulnerability, or they have a greater sexual response. A lot of their sexual abuse doesn't hurt and produces a sexual response in the child, which can be very confusing.

Hello, and welcome to Real Crime Profile. This is Jim Clemente, retired FBI Profile of Former New York City Prosecutor and right to producer on CBS's Criminal Minds. And with me today is Lisa Zambezi, casting director for C.A.P.S. is Criminal Minds, where Jim Clemente is my colleague. And we are missing very much our Lady Laura.

Laura is across the pond and unfortunately due to illness and all the things she's doing over there, changing laws and having cases one.

That's right. That's right. She's over there doing trainings and doing a campaign for Paladin. It is National Stocking Awareness Week this week in the UK.

And Paladin and Vice have this hashtag Unfollow Me campaign. And they're launching a third part of this campaign that's aimed at young people and university students.

And they've launched a new young person service. So that's a lot, a lot, a lot for her to be doing. So she could not join us today for various reasons.

But we are going to carry on and continue our discussion before we get into today's subject. I do want to do a little bit of housekeeping and just mention that the RCP book club is coming along. It's going to be on Saturday, May 4th at 3 p.m.

Los Angeles time Pacific time and we're all going to be book are you covering.

We are covering where monsters hide the story of sex murder and madness in the Midwest and it's by M William Phelps. You can get it on Amazon or wherever you buy your books. And I've already given away 10 free books to people who've been posting their pictures with the books. I really appreciate that.

And if you want to join the book club, boom, you're in. You're in. All you have to do is get the book and get the zoom Z O O M application downloaded onto your computer. And we will all be linked by the magic of the interwebs on Saturday, May 4th at 3 p.m.

So that's that. Before we start today's topic, I wanted to give out the number of the national sexual assault hotline because today's today's topic is it's been triggering me all over the place. And I know a lot of our listeners too. But that hotline is 1 800 646 hope.

That's 1 800 646 4673 and that's the hotline to rain, which is our a and and and.org and that's the rape abuse and incest national network.

And also we want to shout out to male survivor.org, which is an international organization specifically focused on male victims of sexual assault. And that organization is around the world.

I've spoken in the UK for them. I've spoken in Australia, New Zealand for them. And like I said, they're an international organization to support males who were sexually victimized. And so if you need help, please reach out to

www.mail survivor.org MLE s you are VIVOR dot org and all these resources are available on our real crime profile website.

So here we go.

So we're going to launch back into our coverage of the documentary series, leaving Neverland. And for both Lisa and I and for Laura, this was a very disturbing documentary series.

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