This is a TVS I on the world.

Hotel Mars episode N. I'm John Bachelor.

I welcome my colleague and co-host and co-p-pilot Dr Livingston, the space show himself.

David, we're going to Mars and we're very privileged to be speaking to a veteran space

explorer. This is David Southwood, a senior research investigator at the Imperial

College in London. Most importantly, for our purposes, a memory of then and now as former director of science and robotic exploration at the

European Space Agency writing most recently at Science magazine about a

dream the Mars Sample return mission at this moment on hold.

Dr. Southwood, a very good evening to you.

Congratulations for your past achievements, but they only care about what's tomorrow.

So we're going to the history of the Mars sample return

that you provide in your science piece.

25 years ago, it was a go and then it was a no-go.

15 years ago, it was a go and then it was a no-go. 15 years ago, it was a no-go.

And one year ago, go, go, no-go.

I find in your piece that the common theme through all of this is

they dreamed the dream, but but they couldn't at the time

justify the expense it gets more expensive all the time. Where in the process is the

Marsample return mission right now because in the rover delivered the first part of it which is to choose samples and leave them for

pickup so where is the process now this debate that's going on about the future of

Mars sample return good evening evening to you, David Southwood.

Well, I think that's a critical question.

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