What's up, everyone? This is Cortland from EndyHackers.com, and you're listening to the

IndieHackers podcast. On this show, I talk to the founders of profitable internet businesses,

and I try to get a sense of what it's like to be in their shoes. How do they get to where they are today?

How do they make decisions at their companies and in their personal lives?

And what exactly makes their businesses tick?

And the goal here, as always, is so that the rest of us can learn from their examples and go on to build our own successful internet businesses.

Join me today is Natalie Nagel, the CEO of a company called Wildbit.

A lot of people talk about building a sustainable business nowadays, but Natalie is one of the few who has already done it.

Wildbit is an 18-year-old software company. It's been around for a long time. It shows no signs

of slowing down anytime soon. They have 30 employees. They're very profitable. They're generating many

millions of dollars per year in revenue. And the best part is that it is completely bootstrapped.

Natalie has never raised a dime from investors, which means that she and her co-founder

slash husband, Chris, control everything. They get to run their company however they want.

Nobody can tell them not to do something. And as a result, they made a lot of very interesting choices that I'm excited to talk about.

So Natalie, welcome to the Indiacas podcast.

And thank you so much for coming on the show.

Thanks, Cortland.

I'm so excited to be here.

I am excited to have you here.

There's so much to talk about with Wild Bit.

You guys have transitioned from being a consulting company to a product company. You've released multiple products, not just one. Some of your products have grown to millions of dollars in revenue. Some of your products have failed and you pulled the plug on them and shut them down. You've spun off a product and sold it to another company. You've hired, I'm sure you've fired. The list just goes on. You're running this company as a husband and wife team, which is fascinating to me. You're doing the whole remote work thing. And you've been doing it since 2000. Way before it was cool. You have a 32-hour work week. You guys have done pretty much everything. You make it sound so good. It's good. It's great. This is all great stuff. It's so hard for me to even know where to start.

What's something that you guys haven't done as a company these past 18 years that you'd be excited to do at some point in the future?

...