I dreamt that you were twisting through seven sums of gold and the gypsy was insisting

that his story must be told I came two in the morning but I took it as a warning that you might be a treasure I could touch but never hold.

Hi, this is Veronica Valley.

Hi, and this is Chip Summers.

Welcome to the Soberful podcast.

We are both in long-time recovery and have worked with thousands of people as therapists and coaches.

On this podcast, we discuss what it's like living an alcohol-free life and any issues to do

with really being in recovery. Today, we're going to be discussing trauma and how it relates

to addiction and abusive drinking, problem drinking and alcoholism.

So, Chip, I've been thinking about this a lot because there was a show here in the States just recently that Oprah did a segment on about adverse childhood experiences.

And I really feel this subject is blowing up. And people are really beginning

to understand how much trauma in children, then how that affects adults. And I mean, I know

it's something we're really familiar with. Sure. And in all my career, I have never met a client who doesn't have a history from early childhood

and perhaps onwards as well that doesn't include incidents that one would describe as traumatic.

Now, some of those things might be emotional trauma, they might be physical trauma,

they might be in some way some sort of abstract trauma in the form of fear and anxiety.

I can't really think of a client I've ever met who hasn't had something really difficult to deal with. It might be a one-off incident.

It could be a prolonged, slow, drip-drip effect of neglectful parenting or poor parenting

or things that have happened during childhood. But either way, it is an absolutely crucial

part of the makeup and the nature of somebody with an alcohol or drug problem.

So when we're talking about ACEs, which stands for diverse childhood experiences, basically it's a test people can do.

And it doesn't necessarily predict that you're going to become an addict or a bank robber or whatever,

...