Hello there, I'm Chuck Todd and this is the Chuck Todd cast at the beginning of the pandemic.

We had a unique chance to see which parts of society were most fragile.

At the time, it felt like we were getting an MRI on businesses, cultural institutions,

and government.

And one sector that was especially hard hit was education, specifically for profit

colleges.

For years, the top universities have been overwhelmed by potentially qualified student

candidates when unable to fit them on campus, leading to a race to the top that no student

can ever really win.

A race that leaves students from diverse backgrounds struggling for a chance to get

ahead.

So, joining me today is Professor David Kirk from the University of California, Berkeley.

He's been arguing that our elite schools should clone themselves and open full scale campuses

in new regions.

As he writes, imagine Harvard San Diego or Yale Houston.

Well, Professor Kirk, welcome to the Todd panel.

It's good to be here, Chuck.

So, it was funny.

We were having a conversation early on in the pandemic about universities and I was convinced

that we were headed for just a calamity for mid-sized, particularly mid-sized private universities.

And there would be this, you know, all this land that suddenly seemed to be obsolete.

And if we're going to go more remote and all of these, you know, universities that spent

...