This is an I-Heart podcast.

Guaranteed Human.

CallZone Media.

Hello and welcome to Better Offline.

I am, of course, your host, Ed Zittron.

Better Offline. Yeah. And no lot of people been asking, hundreds of thousands of people. In fact, I will be submitting myself at the next DNC as the left is Joe Rogan.

I am two or three inches taller as well.

But today I'm joined by Professor William Lazzonic.

He's a professor

emeritus of economics over at University of Massachusetts and the co-founder of the academic

industry research network. William, thank you so much for coming. Pleasure to be here. All right. So,

if you look at the tech industry right now, it's definitely the most profitable it's ever

been and probably the worst. It feels like the furthest it's definitely the most profitable it's ever been, and probably the worst.

It feels like the furthest it's been from really innovating, and it's moved to value extraction,

I think, and you know a great deal about that. How did we get here? And I mean historically,

how did we get here? Well, first of all, you have to understand that the United States has the most formidable developmental state in history.

A lot of people think that Japan in the 80s invented the developmental state.

But actually, the United States was Japan developmental state from the point of view of technology.

So I won't go into the whole history of that, but it goes back to the 19th century. but actually the United States was Japan developmental state from the point of view of technology.

So I won't go into the whole history of that, but it goes back to the 19th century,

building of land-grant colleges, railroads, and going into aviation, the computer industry, etc.

Lovely. So tech was provided with all kinds of resources.

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