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The David Frum Show

Why We Changed Our Minds About Politics

The David Frum Show

The Atlantic

Politics, News, News Commentary

4.62.4K Ratings

🗓️ 18 February 2026

⏱️ 54 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

On this week’s episode of “The David Frum Show,” David opens with a warning about President Trump’s escalating efforts to bend American institutions to his will. David explains how episodes including the Justice Department’s attempted prosecution of members of Congress, the political pressure on the Federal Reserve, and the campaign-style appeals delivered at Fort Bragg represent a systematic attempt to erode the guardrails of American democracy. Then, David is joined by Mona Charen, a contributor at “The Bulwark” and longtime conservative commentator. Together, they reflect on their shared political evolution—from their early days as Reagan-era conservatives to their break with today’s Republican Party. They discuss what they believe they got right and what they got wrong, how Trump transformed the conservative movement, and why the version of conservatism they once believed in may be gone. Finally, David discusses “My Early Beliefs,” the 1938 essay by John Maynard Keynes, and explores what Keynes’s reflections on changing one’s mind can teach us about political growth. Get more from your favorite Atlantic voices when you subscribe. You’ll enjoy unlimited access to Pulitzer-winning journalism, from clear-eyed analysis and insight on breaking news to fascinating explorations of our world. Atlantic subscribers also get access to exclusive subscriber audio in Apple Podcasts. Subscribe today at TheAtlantic.com/Listener. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0

Hello, and welcome to the David From show.

0:14.4

I'm David From, a staff writer at the Atlantic. My guest this week will be Mona Charon,

0:19.6

and we'll be discussing things we've

0:21.6

changed our mind about since our days as young Reaganites a long, long time ago. My book this

0:27.6

week will be an essay on a similar theme, My Early Beliefs by John Maynard Keynes, in which the

0:33.0

great English philosopher and economist discusses how his views had changed from the early 20th century

0:38.8

to the time in which he delivered this essay just before the Second World War. But before either

0:43.5

the dialogue or the book, some thoughts about a remarkable development in the week just past.

0:49.9

One of the defining characteristics of the Trump years has been the determination of President Trump and the people around them to turn into instruments of presidential will, federal agencies that were always thought of as more or less independent and apolitical.

1:04.2

The Department of Justice, well, it's an armament is part of the administration for sure, and the Attorney General is an appointee of the president.

1:11.1

But there had always been a belief that the actions of the Department of Justice, especially

1:14.8

the criminal enforcement actions, were not dictated for political reasons by the president.

1:20.0

Well, that idea has just gone up in smoke in the Trump years.

1:22.9

This has been the most nakedly political Department of Justice, perhaps since Warren Hardings in the 1920s,

1:30.8

and maybe the most in history because of the recent event where Janine Piro, U.S. Attorney for

1:35.4

the District of Columbia, supposedly acting on her own, but obviously acting at the command

1:40.3

of Attorney General Bondi, who was acting obviously at the command of Donald Trump,

1:43.6

when the U.S. Attorney for the District of Columbia actually tried to indict six members of Congress,

1:50.1

four of them, members of the House of Representatives, two of them, United States senators,

1:53.7

for making a video urging U.S. military personnel to obey lawful orders and not to obey illegal orders, which you would think is something

2:02.1

that would be as basic as telling the President of the United States not to take bribes.

2:06.0

How could such a statement be controversial unless the President was taking bribes and unless the

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