This is Paul Adamson and I'm in conversation with Annan Menon. Annen is director of the UK

Interchanging Europe project based at King's College London. Anand we're going to talk about the UK

referendum on membership of the EU obviously. So why did the UK vote to leave? Well in terms of

why people voted leave one of the interesting things is I think people

voted leave for a whole variety of reasons and we're seeing that now in the fight over what

out means.

There are some who voted leave because they're obsessed by the issue of sovereignty, democracy,

control.

There are others for whom immigration was the major issue, and there are still

others, and I think these are the most interesting lump of people, if you like, for whom the vote

gave an opportunity to rebel against an establishment they'd seen as having abandoned them

for many years. So it wasn't up so much that I've a vote against the EU per se. It was a vote

against the British government? Well, actually I'd say the British political

system rather than the British government. I mean, certainly very few Tories voted the way David

Cameron wanted them to, so I think it's wrong simply to focus on labour as having problems. Much

attention has focused on Jeremy Corbyn, but actually the Conservatives were the real problem.

But I think this was a protest against what we now in Britain call all the time

the establishment.

Okay. But therefore, on the Labour side, I mean, there was supposed to be the key swing

of voters and, and, okay, the jury's out in terms of how many people, of the proportional

Labour voters actually turn out to vote on the day. But why did Labour not succeed in

galvanising, motivating more of its base, of his supporters

...