Why The Five Fold Ministry Collides || Cultural Catalysts

The Kris Vallotton Podcast

Kris Vallotton

Religion & Spirituality

4.8 • 2.6K Ratings

🗓️ 11 September 2025

⏱️ 69 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

In this week's episode of “Cultural Catalysts,” Kris Vallotton sits down with Banning Liebscher, founder of Jesus Culture, and Gabe Valenzuela, pastor at Bethel Church, for a candid conversation about how the fivefold ministry functions in real church leadership. These three leaders, who have known each other for many years, explore the dynamic relationship between apostolic, prophetic, and pastoral gifts within the body of Christ. With refreshing honesty, they discuss how each office brings unique perspectives that are essential for building healthy church cultures, and share personal stories of their journey from misunderstanding to deeply valuing each other's gifts. Join us as they pull back the curtain on Bethel's leadership transition, revealing the beautiful yet challenging process of fathers making room for the next generation to build. Whether you're a church leader or simply interested in healthy spiritual community, this conversation offers invaluable wisdom on how different leadership gifts can work together to create environments where people truly thrive. Pre-Order Kris’ New Book Just Stand Here: https://www.krisvallotton.com/book-details/just-stand Connect with Kris Vallotton: Website: https://www.krisvallotton.com/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/kvministries/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/kvministries/ X: https://x.com/kvministries Additional Resources by Kris Vallotton: https://shop.bethel.com/collections/kris-vallotton About Kris Vallotton: Kris Vallotton is the Senior Associate Leader of Bethel Church, Redding, and is the Co-Founder of Bethel School of Supernatural Ministry (BSSM) and Spiritual Intelligence Institute. He is also the Founder and President of Moral Revolution and a sought-after international conference speaker. Kris and his wife, Kathy, have trained, developed, and pastored prophetic teams and supernatural schools all over the world.

Transcript

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0:00.0	Hi, Chris Valleton here. Welcome to my podcast, where I hope to inspire you to transform the world within you and transform the world around you. I hope you enjoy today's episode.
0:15.1	Hey, welcome to Cultural Cowlis, where we teach you how to live fully live, co-laver with God, and change the world. I'm your host, Chris Valleton, and today I have my very good friend, he's already laughing. Bany Leipshire. Why would you be laughing as you introduced me? I'm a hero of yours, Chris. I'm thinking about it. I've known you since you're like 12.
0:41.0	We were having to decide whether or not we're going to edit all the stories.
0:43.1	In the next 45 minutes. I'm trying to tell people who you are.
0:45.4	He's the founder of Jesus culture.
0:48.3	And now he's planted a church was like six years ago now?
0:51.9	How long ago?
0:53.1	11 almost.
0:54.0	Oh my gosh. 11 years ago in Sacramento area. And San Diego? And San Diego. Just did one in San Diego. Yeah. Well, four years ago, but yes. Thank you for being here. It's good to be here. Always love hanging with you. There's a few people I can sit around and just have a conversation with like you. Yeah. At your, seriously, I come stay at your house and we sit around your kitchen table and just argue and disagree. We don't argue. I'm saying it a good way. We have a dialogue. Yeah, no, no, I'm saying there's few people that I can actually sit down. Other people don't understand us. They're like, why are you arguing? What are you talking about? that was a great conversation. So on cultural catalyst, we decided to change the format about two months ago.
1:33.0	And so this is our first try at a new format.
1:36.3	And I said, they're like, who should we bring on?
1:38.5	I said, we should bring banning on.
1:40.5	That'll be a great, we'll see if this ship will sail at all. I don't know if it's an honor or... Thank you for being on. It is good to be here. And honestly, what you're doing with the podcast, and I mean, we've known each other 30 years now. I know. It's crazy. Which is crazy to say that 30 years. But there are few people, I mean this now, I know we joke a lot,
2:01.7	we're sarcastic a lot. There's few people that dream at the level you dream, have vision.
2:06.5	Every time I'm around you, I just walk away going, I feel tired from the amount of vision
2:10.5	that Chris just shared with me. And so, don't give my team any more excuses.
2:17.2	No, but you are somebody that i've known from day
2:20.2	one that gets the word of the lord and goes after it and is very intent on we're going to go change
2:25.8	how old are you 49 49 so i so i did meet you at when you were 19 19 yeah so i'm just saying
2:32.3	and i was your boss when you were like, what, 22 or something?
2:34.9	Yeah,
2:35.2	you were my boss early on.
	...

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