Why Is Taylor Swift So Polarizing Now? A ‘Showgirl’ Roundtable + Listener Mailbag!

Popcast

The New York Times

Music Interviews, Music Commentary, Music

3.6 • 1.5K Ratings

🗓️ 10 October 2025

⏱️ 91 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

Our team of Swift experts debate her blockbuster new album and take questions about its themes and controversies. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.

Transcript

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0:00.0	Welcome to the New York Times, you're a pretty latehaping
0:15.5	painting of music, news, and criticism.
0:18.4	I'm John Caramonica.
0:20.2	I'm Joe Cascarlli.
0:21.7	It's Taylor, Showgirl, Popcast, 2, Mailbag Bugaloo.
0:27.4	The Whole Gang is here.
0:28.7	Karen Gans is here.
0:30.1	I'm back.
0:31.4	Lindsay Zolads is here.
0:32.8	Hello.
0:33.6	John Perales is here up on the big board.
0:36.6	In a cameo.
0:37.5	That's an a cameo.
0:41.0	That's an expensive cameo.
0:45.9	There are, okay, so we're here for a few reasons.
0:50.1	We're here because everybody's got Taylor bars they need to get off.
0:56.0	We're here because, as always, the Taylor Mailbag is full to overflowing.
0:57.2	What does it mean?
1:05.0	We'll get to what does it mean that we are most beloved, reviled for speaking about Taylor's.
1:08.1	Well, that's maybe the last question we'll get to.
1:11.6	We are also here, I regret to say with an apology.
1:14.7	We have to start with our regrets.
	...

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