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Past Due with Ana Marie Cox and Open Mike Eagle

When Your Thoughts Are Not Your Own

Past Due with Ana Marie Cox and Open Mike Eagle

Ana Marie Cox, Open Mike Eagle, and Andrew Steven

Business, Performing Arts, Arts, Society & Culture

4.6 • 6.4K Ratings

🗓️ 29 May 2020

⏱️ 35 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

So far this season of “WFLT: Converts Edition,” we’ve focused on why the brain resists change — but that doesn’t mean that people give up on trying. Previous episodes have taught us that arguing doesn’t work and that people’s beliefs can be impervious to facts. But what about the blunt force approach? What about… brainwashing? We'll talk to science writer Kathleen Turner, author of the book, "Brainwashing: The Science of Thought Control.” Thanks to our sponsors! Best Fiends: If you’re looking for a fun way to pass the time while engaging your brain and enjoying breathtaking visuals and a gripping story, your answer is Best Fiends, free on the Apple App Store or Google Play. Crooked Media’s own Adopt-a-State program! Ahead of this year’s elections, the team at Crooked has been hard at work trying to find the best ways for all of you to impact its results aside (of course) from casting your own ballot. Now they have an answer: Vote Save America’s brand new Adopt A State program.  The Adopt A State program lets you directly support the work of organizers, volunteers, and candidates in the six key battleground states that will be most important to winning a progressive majority in 2020: Michigan, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Arizona, Florida, and North Carolina. When you sign up to adopt a state at votesaveamerica.com/adopt, you’ll get specific calls to action—things you can do yourself, from home, right now—that will make a huge impact on the races in these states.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0

Hi, I'm Annamarie Cox and welcome to With Friends Like These Converts edition.

0:09.9

We will be spending the entire season looking at converts and conversion experiences.

0:16.1

So far, we've been focusing on the rules of social psychology and neuroscience that make

0:21.6

those conversion experiences the fascinating exception.

0:25.9

It is almost impossible to change your own mind or to change someone else's.

0:31.4

Of course, just because it's difficult to impossible doesn't mean that people don't try.

0:37.6

And in this episode, we're going to talk about the most extreme version of changing someone

0:42.4

else's mind, brainwashing, thought control, indoctrination, the spooky stuff, in other words.

0:52.0

We'll be guided through the process by science writer Kathleen Taylor, author of Brainwashing,

0:57.0

The Science of Thought Control.

0:59.0

We reached her by phone in London.

1:03.2

Kathleen, welcome to the show.

1:04.5

Thank you for having me.

1:05.6

So this is a series about conversion experiences.

1:09.4

And for the first couple of shows, we focused on why it is very hard for one person to change

1:15.2

their own mind.

1:17.0

But I was hoping you could help us understand the extreme end of the other side of the issue,

1:25.1

which is when people try to force others to change their minds.

1:31.3

That's brainwashing, right?

1:32.3

That's what people think of as brainwashing.

1:34.9

Yes, the classic kind of mentoring and candidate perspective whereby somebody goes into a situation

1:42.0

of captivity and stress and comes out miraculously different with their all their beliefs changed

...

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