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The Counsel

When Juries Push Back

The Counsel

Vox Media Podcast Network

News, Politics

4.7861 Ratings

🗓️ 14 November 2025

⏱️ 10 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

Elie Honig is a former Assistant U.S. Attorney and co-chief of the organized crime unit at the Southern District of New York, where he prosecuted more than 100 mobsters, including members of La Cosa Nostra, and the Gambino and Genovese crime families. He went on to serve as Director of the Department of Law and Public Safety at New Jersey Division of Criminal Justice. He is currently Special Counsel at Lowenstein Sandler and a CNN legal analyst.  For a transcript of Elie’s note and the full archive of contributor notes, head to CAFE.com. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0

It's time for Black Friday at Dell Technologies.

0:02.7

Save big on PCs like the Dell 16 Plus featuring Intelcore Ultra Processors.

0:07.3

Shop now at Dell.com.

0:08.3

Okay, forward slash Black Friday.

0:11.5

Hey, everyone, Ellie here, wishing you a happy Friday.

0:14.5

Before we get to the heart of this week's podcast, two quick things.

0:18.9

So first of all, I'm sure many or all of you saw that earlier this

0:23.3

week, the U.S. Supreme Court denied cert, meaning rejected, will not take up the case seeking

0:29.4

to overturn Obergefell, seeking to overturn the case from 10 years ago that recognized the right

0:36.1

to gay marriage. I'm happy to say,

0:38.5

look, we make predictions in this space. Sometimes they come true. Sometimes they don't. But I did

0:42.8

write a piece back in August saying that that was exactly what would happen. That does not mean

0:47.5

that gay marriage will never be challenged. It will probably continually be challenged. But it does

0:52.8

mean that there's zero appetite or not enough appetite in the Supreme Court right now to take it up. I do think that right is safe for the near and immediate term future. And look, I usually don't take a rooting interest in these things, but I was happy to see that outcome. I'm happy to see the Supreme

1:10.9

Court reject this challenge and reaffirm the right to gay marriage. Second of all, boy,

1:18.3

we saw this new bunch of emails released from the Jeffrey Epstein case. I don't want to say

1:24.3

the Jeffrey Epstein files because that sort of suggests that they're

1:27.8

tidier than they are. There's not like some redwell that contains all the files. But we saw

1:33.1

House Democrats release three emails came out Wednesday morning that are pretty remarkable. Look,

1:41.0

there's a lot we don't know. They raise a lot of questions about what we know

1:45.5

and about what people have said. I will tell you my gut reaction to those emails is these are going

1:51.6

to reignite the story in a meaningful way. It's not just the continued drip, drip, drip.

...

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