4.7 • 798 Ratings
🗓️ 2 November 2022
⏱️ 45 minutes
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0:00.0 | We argue from the starting point that what founders do is that they create the how and the why for the organization. |
0:09.8 | And then each successor pivots themselves and positions themselves relative to that founder's frames. |
0:18.3 | I think a visionary is best positioned to revitalize al-Qaeda, but that doesn't necessarily indicate a visionary will appear. |
0:26.6 | Because I think failure to understand that type of leader is a failure to really then tailor the counterterrorism, the appropriate counterterrorism approach against that group. |
0:37.7 | Hey, welcome back to the Modern War Institute podcast. I'm John Amble, editorial director at |
0:42.2 | MWI, and my guests on this episode are Dr. Elizabeth Grimm and Dr. Trisha Bacon. |
0:47.3 | Dr. Grimm is an associate professor of teaching in Georgetown University's security studies program, |
0:52.0 | and Dr. Bacon is an associate professor in the School |
0:54.7 | of Public Affairs at American University. Together, they also authored the recently released book |
0:59.8 | Terror in Transition, Leadership and Succession in Terrorist Organizations. |
1:04.5 | This past summer, the death of Iman al-Zawahiri in Kabul, Afghanistan, marked a significant |
1:09.2 | and rare inflection point for Al-Qaeda. |
1:11.6 | He was only the group's second leader in the more than three decades since its founding. |
1:15.6 | That makes it a unique opportunity to take stock of al-Qaeda's evolution |
1:19.6 | and also explore the types of leaders at the helm of terrorist organizations. |
1:23.6 | When Zawahiri succeeded Osama bin Laden, what kind of leadership model did he adopt and what did that signal about the organization's trajectory? |
1:31.3 | And especially important now, what type of leader will replace Zawahiri and how should that inform U.S. counterterrorism policy? |
1:38.3 | It's a really interesting discussion, but before we get to it, a couple of quick notes. |
1:42.3 | First, if you aren't following MWI and social media, you can find us on Twitter, Facebook, or LinkedIn. And second, |
1:48.0 | as always, what you hear in this episode are the views of the participants and don't represent |
1:51.6 | those of West Point, the Army, or any other agency of the U.S. government. All right, here's my |
1:56.0 | conversation with Elizabeth Grimm and Trisha Bacon. |
... |
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