Hey, guys, welcome back. Thanks so much for tuning in. Today I have what I think is a really

interesting and fun one with none other than my big brother, Jason Bowman. Jason is a meditator,

so we spend the bulk of our conversation talking about meditation practice. I thought it would

be interesting and relevant based on the fact that

meditation has really become a buzzword, something that's been really popular and prominent in

sport and business and healthy lifestyle. And Jason is somebody with a ton of experience, to say

the least. Jason has really devoted the last 10 years of his life to

Vopasana meditation retreats. And for those who don't know, of course, we sort of cover this in

the podcast, but Vapasana retreats are typically 10 days long. They are completely silent. You're not

allowed to read. You're not allowed to write. You're not allowed to write. You're not

allowed to exercise. You're not even allowed to really make eye contact with the other individuals

who are on retreat with you. It's really a tool in which you're able to go deep, deep inside,

much in the same way that ultra running is a way in which we go

deep within ourselves to learn a lot more. And Jason and I have always sort of laughed about the

parallel paths that we've taken and the sort of interesting and similar trajectories we've

been on over the last 10 years because we sort of

found our life's purpose around the same time, right? For me, it was ultra-running, obviously. And

for Jason, again, it was spiritual life and meditation specifically. So we talk a lot about the

practical application of meditation in your life. We talk about the

vipasana practice, what it entails, how he prepares. We talk about identity stuff, things that I've

been dealing with this year that I've learned a lot about and how meditation has helped to shape

Jason's relationship with himself and how he sees himself and presents himself

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