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What Drives You with Kevin Miller

Try Replacing All Your “Goals” With “Experiments” To Make Real Progress w/ Anne-Laure Le Cunff

What Drives You with Kevin Miller

Kevin Miller

Education, Relationships, How To, Social Sciences, Nutrition, Life Sciences, Spirituality, Medicine, Religion & Spirituality, Science, Society & Culture, Health & Fitness, Mental Health, Self-improvement

4.41.4K Ratings

🗓️ 28 July 2025

⏱️ 66 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

We as humans tend to look at most everything with a linear perspective. Like every day and our lives are a straight trajectory that is either getting better or worse, depending on the day. We look at our desires as goals and work towards them sequentially, expecting to get closer every day on this so-called, straight line. My guest in this episode is a neuroscientist who believes this is an errant perspective and what our lives and pursuits really align with is experiments. Instead of sequential progress we are often starting over, again and again, till we get it right. I recall the TV series "Lessons in Chemistry," where the main character, Elizabeth Zott, perfected her lasagna recipe after making it 78 times. This wasn’t a linear goal, but an exercise in starting over 78 times, with more wisdom each time. For me this really helps with trying this and then trying that to see what works instead of pushing for one method and feeling like a failure if it doesn’t work. Dr. Anne-Laure Le Cunff, PhD, is a neuroscientist, entrepreneur, and writer whose work has been in peer-reviewed journals and WIRED, Forbes, Fortune, and Entrepreneur. Her new book is called, Tiny Experiments: How to Live Freely in a Goal-Obsessed World and it’s a guide to adopting and living a more experimental life, turning uncertainty into curiosity, and carving a path of self-discovery. Sign up for your $1/month trial period at shopify.com/kevin Go to shipstation.com and use code KEVIN to start your free trial. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

Welcome. I'm Kevin Miller, and this is a podcast for your personal evolution. In this episode,

0:08.5

try replacing all your goals with experiments to make real progress. So we as humans, we tend to look

0:17.5

at most everything with this linear perspective, like every day and our

0:21.3

lives are just a straight trajectory that's either getting better or worse. It's going up or down,

0:26.6

depending on the day. We look at our desires as these goals, and we work towards them seemingly

0:32.0

sequentially, right? Expecting to get closer every day on this so-called straight line. Well, my guest in this episode

0:39.7

is a neuroscientist who believes it's an errant perspective and what our lives and pursuits

0:45.7

really align with is tiny experiments. Instead of this sequential progress, we're often starting

0:52.8

over again and again until we get it right.

0:56.0

I recalled thinking about it, the TV series, Lessons in Chemistry, where the main character, Elizabeth Zott, she performed a lasagna recipe after making it, or she perfected it after making it 78 times.

1:10.1

Well, that wasn't a linear goal like we think about it,

1:12.8

but it was an exercise in starting over 78 times

1:16.4

with more wisdom each time.

1:19.7

And for me,

1:20.1

this helps with trying this and trying that

1:23.6

to see what works instead of pushing for one method

1:26.4

and feeling like a failure if it doesn't

1:28.3

work. So my guest, Dr. Ann Lorr Lecunf. She's a PhD, a neuroscientist, an entrepreneur, and a writer

1:36.5

whose work has been in peer-reviewed journals, Wired Magazine, Forbes, Fortune, and Entrepreneur.

1:43.0

And her new book is called Tiny Experiments,

1:46.7

How to Live Freely in a Goal Obsessed World. Really popular. It just came out and is selling

1:54.0

like crazy and I think rightly so. And it's a guide to adopting and living this more

...

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