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Hi, Bill Crystal here. Welcome to full work on Sunday. Very pleased to be joined today by

Nathaniel Zelensky. I met a little over 10 years ago when he was a law

student at Yale and I was a conservative law student and I was a conservative speaker. And that's,

I guess, how we met. And last, I think we met when I was in undergrad. Is that right? It was almost 20 years ago.

Yeah, I was a conservative editor of the weekly standard. Things have changed in those two decades or even in the last decade. That's Yeah. I was a conservative undergrad. Yeah. Right. And I was a conservative editor of the

weekly standard. Things have changed in those two decades or even in the last decade. That's it. I've forgotten that we'd met earlier than that. Anyway, Fanioz has been a, went on to a distinguished career as a appellate and Supreme Court lawyer in big law, quit his law firm in 2025, but it was one of the firms that took the deal that Trump offered.

As you recall, all those law firms were being pressured to cut deals with Trump and his did,

and you, Nathaniel, you quit. You started a boutique appellate, well, law firm, Washington Litigation

Group, which is a 501c3, a not-for-profit entity with several

other fine lawyers, younger ones, also some older ones, you're managing counsel of that firm,

and that firm defends individuals and institutions and the rule of law more generally in the era

of Trump.

And you've done a great job. And one reason I wanted to talk to you, but in general about the rule of all more generally in the era of Trump. And you've done a great job.

And one reason I wanted to talk to you, but in general about the state of play and introduce you to our audience, but also you were the lead counsel on the Kennedy Center case, which there was a pretty notable decision Friday. So I thought we should begin with that. Anyway, Nathaniel, thanks for joining me here. Happy to be here, Bill. I think you also wrote a couple of pieces for the bulwark, right? When you were...

Yeah, yeah, back in... begin with that. Anyway, Nathaniel, thanks for joining me here. Happy to be here, Bill. I think you

also wrote a couple of pieces for the bulwark, right? When you were... Yeah, yeah, back in, back I think in 2020, 2021, yeah. Yeah, yeah, good, yeah. Okay, so Kennedy, tell us about the, I mean, people know the headline of the Kennedy Center case that the judge found against the Trump appointed board's decision to rename it and to close it per Trump's orders

...