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Pitchfork Economics with Nick Hanauer

Trade Wars Are Class Wars (with Matthew C. Klein)

Pitchfork Economics with Nick Hanauer

Civic Ventures

Business, Government, News, Politics

4.81.5K Ratings

🗓️ 7 October 2025

⏱️ 50 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

What if global trade isn’t really a fight between nations—but between classes? In the fourth episode of our Trade series, Nick and Goldy talk with economist and writer Matthew C. Klein, co-author of Trade Wars Are Class Wars: How Rising Inequality Distorts the Global Economy and Threatens International Peace. Klein argues that the real story behind trade imbalances isn’t about countries “winning” or “losing”—it’s about how elites hoard profits while workers everywhere pay the price. From China’s suppressed wages to Wall Street’s endless appetite for financial assets, this conversation exposes how the true conflict in trade is between labor and capital—and what it would take to build a more equitable global economy. Matthew Klein is an economist, writer, and co-author of Trade Wars Are Class Wars: How Rising Inequality Distorts the Global Economy and Threatens International Peace. He writes The Overshoot, a publication focused on global economics and financial markets, and his work has appeared in the Financial Times, Barron’s, and The Economist. Social Media: @M_C_Klein Further reading:  Trade Wars Are Class Wars: How Rising Inequality Distorts the Global Economy and Threatens International Peace THE OVERSHOOT: Making sense of the global economy and financial markets Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social TikTok: @pitchfork_econ Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer, @civicaction YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Substack: ⁠The Pitch⁠

Transcript

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0:00.0

The rising inequality and growing political instability that we see today are the direct result of decades of bad economic theory.

0:10.9

The last five decades of trickle-down economics haven't worked. But what's the alternative?

0:16.3

Middle-out economics is the answer. Because the middle class is the source of growth, not its consequence.

0:23.1

That's right.

0:28.7

This is pitchfork economics with Nick Hanauer, a podcast about how to build the economy from the middle out.

0:36.9

Welcome to the show.

0:41.7

I'm not sure when this episode will be airing, Nick, but at a time when Trump is playing

0:48.7

Russian roulette with India, essentially loading 50% tariffs into his pistol in response to...

0:59.0

Who even knows?

0:59.9

Who even knows?

1:00.8

Because I thought he's buddies with Putin.

1:02.9

Who knows?

1:03.8

God, it's crazy.

1:05.1

We're in the middle of more...

1:07.4

Very well-thought-out Trump trade policy.

1:11.6

It really raises the issue of tariffs.

1:15.4

When people think about that's what he's doing, tariffs,

1:18.3

it's a tax on imported goods.

1:21.5

And allegedly, allegedly, Nick, a lot of this,

1:25.7

India side is aimed at countries who have been treating us unfairly,

1:32.1

according to Trump.

1:33.3

Correct.

...

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