This is really the political moment the tech industry has been waiting for.

I think that's also why we see such an increase in lobby spending.

You're listening to EU Watchdog Radio.

Hi, welcome.

I'm Joanna Com's Officer at Corporate Europe Observatory or CEO. In today's episode, I will talk to my colleague, Brahm Vrancanken about a new report he has just published about

big tech and its lobby budget. By big tech, we are referring to the main technological companies in the

world, Google, Amazon, Meta, Apple and Microsoft, also referred to by the French acronym Gaffam,

where the F stood for Facebook, which is now called Meta.

I'm not going to interrupt the conversation we recorded, but just to welcome you, I can't help but mention that Bram and our friends at the German NGO lobby control have discovered that there

are now more big tech lobbyists operating

in Brussels than there are members of the European Parliament. Their lobby spending has grown

accordingly and since 2021 they've declared to have increased their spending by more than 55%. The sheer

muscle power these companies have to target legislation

and to lobby decision makers is unheard of, and it is worth reminding ourselves that

big tech's lobby power only further entrenches its hold over key aspects of society and of our

lives, from the information we consume to the digital infrastructure on which we depend.

I mean, you are probably listening to this podcast in an app that belongs to one of those companies,

or using a device which was built by one of them.

Without further ado, here's my conversation with Bram.

You have new research that you've done with lobby control,

which is a German NGO that is a little bit of a CEO's sister organization.

And you looked into the lobby firepower of big tech so what was the most surprising thing

...